Ep 86 - Me and my OCD

hi everyone good morning good afternoon good evening wherever you are welcome to the psychology in spirituality a bridge to Better Life discussion my name is Marcia Tran I'm your host and with me is yudi Castro you it is so good to have you back with us and for those of you who do not know him he is a clinical psychologist and a spiritist member of the conscious living spiritist group and he lives in North Miami in Florida hi yudi good morning good afternoon good evening thank you Marcia it's a pleasure to be back here awesome it is good to have you back but for you who's here with us and this is perhaps the first time you're watching listening to the podcast program please note that our program psychology and spirit neity weekly talks are based on the works by Joanna d'angeles and we're here to provide in a very informal conversation a safe space to for us to just think about what do we Define certain things how do we can we confront it's a very very safe space but can we also compare correlate and most importantly expand our Concepts from both spiritual and psychological lenss today's program I want to thank all of those organizations that are sponsoring us are manando Kam the United State Spirits Federation the international spiritual Council and Amy Brazil yudi I was thinking right about uh the fact that a lot of us are dealing today with the so-called obsessive compulsive disorder and when we do this is um we report some you know the fact that some life changes it may be positive or negative it doesn't matter they can be so stressful that they trigger some of the symptoms and um I understand that it doesn't matter what it is it could be let's say oh I'm starting a new job boom and I get my OCD triggered or I lost my job or I'm moving out of my parents home or I'm moving to another city oh I'm getting to a new relationship happiness happiness or even getting married getting engaged getting divorced right so there's a a plethora of a triggering um uh ideas or events that may be quite

oh I'm getting to a new relationship happiness happiness or even getting married getting engaged getting divorced right so there's a a plethora of a triggering um uh ideas or events that may be quite difficult for anyone to deal with in addition to those external events I understand that uh wo lack of sleep not eating well or eating not moving enough or or even hormonal changes can trigger that and I you as a clinical psychologist I'd love to hear from you can we start perhaps y with the definition what is OCD yes I think you bring up some interesting points uh OCD obsessive compulsive disorder OCD the in simple terms OCD can be understood as the these obsessions so the O is the obsessions those are thoughts images or urges so that's the definition from the DSM 5tr which is a diagnostic statistical manual that's the one that psychiatrists and psychologists at least in the United States we use to diagnose uh people so these obsessions are these thoughts images or urges and they're unwanted they're unpleasant and the compulsions are the behaviors that people do to compensate for the anxiety and or distress caused by those thoughts so let me let me see if I understand so there's a it's a dichotomy if you will the two sides of the equation one are the fixations May call it fixed ideas obsessions images so it's very uh mental and then composion the other component of it is actually the expression of that is that a a maybe a coping mechanism or or something that helps us with OCD to deal with that uh uh Obsession or imagery Yi can you explain better absolutely so the obsessions like I said these images thoughts or urges these are internal processes so these are if we think of a domino effect of sorts of a sequence these thoughts images of UR or urges they come to the person and then they do the behaviors the compulsions okay to alleviate the distress and anxiety as a compensatory mechanism for those thoughts images or urges yeah so and it's interesting here to highlight

and then they do the behaviors the compulsions okay to alleviate the distress and anxiety as a compensatory mechanism for those thoughts images or urges yeah so and it's interesting here to highlight that these behaviors can be overt they can be things that we observe or they can be covered they can be internal things that they do as well that we don't realize people with OCD for instance they start counting on their heads or like repeating a prayer over and over and over and over and from The Outsiders perspective Ive we would know that compensatory Behavior but they are but there is regardless if it's a very uh visible or not there is a consequence to that and I wonder uh yudi when we when we say that and and uh it's it's sad I don't know uh your thoughts about it but uh I have seen way too many comedic expressions or or um showing expressing that in in the media out there be it movies or or even uh standup comedians talking about those expressions of that compulsive disorder uh one one movie that I remember um we we talked about in the program actually um as as as good I think it was as good as it gets with uh Jack Nicholson he he has obsessive compulsive disorder and that's not the most uh uh the the most dramatic ones there are other in the comedian type of things it's the the series called monk that he just right he he goes home he comes back and he has to do a certain number of uh TR you know number of uh behaviors to quiet his mind that he's done right and uh and I I I hate to see this um um this just dismissive way to to look at something that can be quite difficult to deal with it um I understand um you treat OCD patients and uh from that perspective can you without uh uh talking about any one patient uh in specifically but can you tell us some of the uh things that you look for as as a clinician to to say oh yeah this is OCD and then how does it how does it work working with somebody to help them in this condition yes there there's a lot there so let me let me try to address some of

clinician to to say oh yeah this is OCD and then how does it how does it work working with somebody to help them in this condition yes there there's a lot there so let me let me try to address some of these points that you brought up so one is the the expression through the media and through no television yes of the OCD condition in fact there is a misrepresentation of so many different psychiatric diagnosis in the in the movies you know one that always comes to my mind it's schizophrenia bipolar those are are severe and persistent mental illnesses that are often um very misrepresented and even the profession of the psychologist itself if I may say it's very misrepresented oftentimes yeah um the so the the OCD specifically the OCD uh is something that causes extreme distress in the in the person it's something that causes you know um impairment in their social life in you know true those ways so the idea here is that when we're helping somebody with OCD what we're doing in fact is we're trying to help them live a a more meaningful life a more fulfilling life being rid of those symptoms or the composite compulsions the compensatory behaviors that they try to engage in or they engage in because of the obsessions and the the idea is that the obsessions when they occur they do the compensatory behaviors but that becomes a cycle because for a moment their anxiety may be lowered their distress May lowered but then when the obsessions come back those thoughts come back they have to do it either more in in terms of quantity or more intensity so we often see the washing hands right let's give that as an example yeah for the people who have OCD related to you know to we call like the germaphobes and things like that contamination obsessions they wash their hands three times but then when the obsession comes back the thought comes back they're gonna they're gonna think three is not enough so they're gonna do five yeah and then seven and then 10 and all of a sudden you have somebody who's

e obsession comes back the thought comes back they're gonna they're gonna think three is not enough so they're gonna do five yeah and then seven and then 10 and all of a sudden you have somebody who's spanning two three hours a day washing their hands their hands are you know the skin is already very hurt yeah and and then you have that that's when you have the problem that's why I said there's a a a severe like not necessarily severe but there's a a remarkable uh distress and impairment in someone's life because of the OCD condition and there are many there are many in in the germophobia uh specific expression uh there are many um very well-known people that have had that right one of them of course is Howard Hughes he he uh I think there's even a movie about it where he had to remove himself over you know more and more because of uh the fear that he would be contaminated by germs and as we know um it's very interesting uh especially with the the pandemic that we all went through 2020 right to 2022 when things started to stabilize a little bit um but that triggered even more um I I can say from a personal perspective uh and I don't believe it was OCD but uh I I understand uh and I know personally individuals that uh would go to to let's say to the grocery store or have it delivered and spent hours with cleaning each product with h very harsh chemicals right to clean and then all their their their shoes had to be uh sterilized and there was just all those things that you you're going to think twice before you go out right and I know individuals that live in highrises that just became shut in because they felt that if they were ever to go into an elevator uh they would get sick so it's one um larger uh event the the the covid-19 pandemic right and how we internalize that uh immersion in an environment that potentially can can hurt you and I and I think bring a very good point because when you were mentioning earlier about the triggers you know that can happen that will uh eventually become perhaps

that potentially can can hurt you and I and I think bring a very good point because when you were mentioning earlier about the triggers you know that can happen that will uh eventually become perhaps an OCD like fullblown OCD you know condition yeah the pandemic is a big one because we we all suffer through that and everybody's anxiety went up and the fear of contamination went up understandably so yeah but of course that that led to some people who perhaps didn't have that condition to acquire that condition uh because of these trigger these uncontrollable environmental factors that happen you know so and the idea to that and it's an interesting one because the fear of contamination the OCD related to that yeah we think of people washing their hands washing or cleaning their houses but one aspect of that specific um OCD type is that they they often avoid public uh places yes avoid um so so then when we're talking before about impairment can you imagine like avoiding all public places that would hinder someone's work capability or work options friendship options you know socialization options so the person starts to the person start to become very limited because of that condition because of those and the compostions so it's spiraling right it it gets worse and worse you mentioned quantity uh and uh or intensity yeah intensity thank you of of the those those mechanism to alleviate the uh the the the compulsive Behavior to alleviate the obsession and then we we also have the idea that it may also lead to uh I being isolated and we this is the big you know the par Paradox here we are in essence uh gregarious uh animals we're social animals we need the the touch we need need the the closeness we need the sense of belonging but this one disorder it's a disorder right OCD uh the D OCD is disorder uh leads to uh difficulties uh in what would otherwise be just daytoday uh source of happiness or perhaps disappointment Etc but still it's part of our repertoire of moments

D uh the D OCD is disorder uh leads to uh difficulties uh in what would otherwise be just daytoday uh source of happiness or perhaps disappointment Etc but still it's part of our repertoire of moments in a in a day's life right I was thinking um just to try to to uh address how Joanna deangeles thinks about it before I hear more from you from the clinical side uh Yodi uh because my you know uh as we all most of us know Jonah d'angeles is a spiritual author and uh uh the work that she's been working or bringing to us is through the very close partnership by valdo Franco right the medium Brazilian medium and uh in the I think was the late 80s and beginning 90s so it's it's it's there is a already a a length of time where dealo fanu started to bring to us through his mediumship books by Jonah d'angeles including the psychology the psychological collection of psychology series uh and this is a series of 16 books one of my favorite Yi and it's just by far my favorite favorite of all of them is the book called existential conflicts right so it she Joanna brings us a lot of conflicts that we go through and and some of them is I don't know could be anxiety could be anger could be fear could be jealousy things that we all have to deal with it but she she discusses uh OCD or or generalized obsessive compulsive behaviors and she says that usually the the spiritual root cause uh of of this is U unresolved uh inner conflicts or uh repressed emotions right so it whatever it is uh either I have a conflict and it can be a conflict with I don't know uh my father or a father figure in my life and and that can lead to that ideation that you refer to or it can be uh thoughts of uh I don't know children do this right oh I hate my mom and this is very uh caricatures put in my father my mother in this example but it be as it may I'm continuing with this example and uh and we say I'm going to I wish you were not my mother so those are very uh strong emotion as a child and then oh uh I'm not a good daughter right so we

s it may I'm continuing with this example and uh and we say I'm going to I wish you were not my mother so those are very uh strong emotion as a child and then oh uh I'm not a good daughter right so we start to repress those emotions and that leads to a certain level of spiritual imbalance right so um how do we handle that do you think whatever it is the trigger inner conflicts of repressed emotions or as we mentioned before hormonal imbalance or uh I'm I'm going through a lot of stress and uh I I it's leading to that uh that I fall into this trap that is called obsessive compulsive disorder yes excellent I I like that book a lot as well and no and and it's it's great that you bring Joanna because obviously she she broadens the topic so much uh going from the clinical to the spiritual side of things she talks a lot in throughout all those those books about these neurotic behaviors she always talking about the Mind Body Spirit connection so she's she's adding a third component that uh Clinical Psychology as a as a whole does not usually account for which which can cause a myopic view of things in my opinion as a psychologist and a spir absolutely and I may just uh ask you what are your thoughts because I know you're you're your clinical psychologist so you you you have your in your by work as well as your education a very specific uh dealing not only with your the the mental health but physical health because they are right they're interrelated but as a spiritist you you have this large knowledge of spiritual influences including OCD uh how how do you manage that Yodi how do you handle that uh that intersection between the two yeah so I I again I think that she like her broadening the horizons or broading the broading the the perspect the perspective of OC right because we definitely we account for the spiritual side of things and in that we can discuss at some point the yeah obsessions or we can discuss past lives how that can impact OCD which it definitely can as Joanna yeah talks in

count for the spiritual side of things and in that we can discuss at some point the yeah obsessions or we can discuss past lives how that can impact OCD which it definitely can as Joanna yeah talks in multiple H books but this idea of you know like like obsessions being she says these storms in one's mind so yeah it's this idea that they can come and they can completely control our thoughts to the point where we start to develop these compository behaviors the yes compostions you know and then it becomes unbearable and that's the the idea that she's saying as far as treatment she is an advocate of psychological treatment but she's also saying about prayer about meditation about these these more holistic approaches to the Mind Body Spirit connection which is extremely interesting in my opinion and and and you who is here with us today you're were listening together right you may think Marcia yudy I am tired and I'm joking here everyone but you may be thinking indeed I am tired of you giving me the same tools to deal with something that is impairing to me yes you say about meditation and prayer and uh you know and all of this but it doesn't help me so y what' you say for for those of us who think that way because it is quite simplistic right if you think about it it is it doesn't deviate much it is all about self-discovery self-love right self forgiveness and when we start to to to to get into this new uh if you think in terms terms of your spiritual emotional ecosystem of uh that is balanced that is that is really well um uh there's a sense of equilibrium and balance and and uh there's room for everything to to to work then when we pray and you go back to that moment of homeostasis right you're you're you're you're balanced you you have a sense of Harmony then things are better in OCD specifically it bring you know just as you're speaking earlier it is uh really uh someone trying to bring some sort of uh uh control to an otherwise chaotic mentally speaking uh chaotic view of the moment right it's

bring you know just as you're speaking earlier it is uh really uh someone trying to bring some sort of uh uh control to an otherwise chaotic mentally speaking uh chaotic view of the moment right it's not I am a chaotic person but I I'm trying to to create a uh sense of control in my life by whatever the behavior may be yeah the the the idea of the trying Joanna does bring up that topic of the sense of trying to get a sense of control or trying to you know get some um she talks about the connection with our spiritual Essence so we live in a very uncontrol uncontrollable environment there's we can control and when we think of these things that are outside of our control the one feeling that arises in every one of us is anxiety when that anxiety is exacerbated that's when we start to see these the development of these OCD behaviors because the obsessions are there the compulator behaviors come uh and to answer your question for those who like you said for those who like you keep saying the same tools and all of that it sounds overs simplistic but the idea is when the more we use to help the conditions so let's say psychological treatment spiritual treatment through you know something simple as as like the habit of prayer like installing Like a Prayer in your day like a prayer meditation you know self-love like self you know forg forgiveness like you said who can also be achieve achieved through therapy and in more extreme cases even the use of psychotropic medication you know like use of a psychiatrist to help with extreme extreme severe cases of OCD there are so many tools to help but the idea is I think that often times s people even in therapy they come and they say I try this I try that if we look deeper if we take like a closer look we'll see a few you know challenges and holes that there were that existed in that plan or in the execution of the plan so you know oh I'm trying prayer but I pray once you know every two weeks yeah and I'm I I like to you when when

ges and holes that there were that existed in that plan or in the execution of the plan so you know oh I'm trying prayer but I pray once you know every two weeks yeah and I'm I I like to you when when people come like that through you know through the clinic and stuff I like to use the the physical analogy because people understand better better say okay let's say you're trying to lose weight and you go to a dietician they give you exactly what you need to eat and how much exercise you need to do for the first week you do it but then the second one you're just exercising for 30 minutes once a week because life gets in the way and you're not eating as you're supposed to you're not gonna go back and say hey I didn't lose weight you know I came here and I didn't lose weight so it's I think it's the same a lot of these times with these meditation techniques with these you know these are all habits these are things that when they're done properly when they're done with frequency with you know with uh discipline that's a big word that Emanual is very keen on another yeah great author um when when these things are done with the purs of intentions with discipline like we start to see the results so that's my that that's one of my my recommendations then yeah and and uh on on a on a different way we can start to look for um the triggers right what are my triggers uh which is this self-awareness at a minimum self-awareness uh I I get anxious when da da therefore let's let's deal with that situation in in a way that is not a source of so much fear anxiety and ultimately uh my triggering my OCD um but I I'm also thinking in terms of uh uh you mentioned Yi we live in a very um out of control Society our days are as diverse and complex as we can imagine uh if you if you look at the the history of civilization right we're becoming um progressively more complex even though technology uh and I I mean that field of Technology from a health perspective right the technolog is becoming more and

ry of civilization right we're becoming um progressively more complex even though technology uh and I I mean that field of Technology from a health perspective right the technolog is becoming more and more advanced to kind of um simplify our lives but it's not the more uh life becomes quote unquote simple because of Technology the more we're offered and uh our decision making process is becoming so difficult because there's just too much to choose too much to watch too much to pay attention and we've become uh in fact a very distracted Society right Yi uh it it's it's hard now and I this is my personal belief or you know thought process here is that we we've got more and more used to intrusions to our lives uh and I remember as a young adult talking about the don't laugh at me I'm old but uh my my bachelor's degree was in architecture and uh at that time one of the discussion that still reverberates today was the fact that the controlling aspect of a TV from an architectural perspective where we not only have the the TV taking over the living room but we have the TV room or the TV in the bedroom a TV in the bathroom right TV in restaurants TV and and it was very interesting how at that time we we talked about the the uh intrusive nature of an object of technology in this case to with at the time maybe three four five channels and today Yi it doesn't matter right it's thousands of channels thousands of inputs into our daily lives that is not uh stationary to a room it actually right goes with you this little this little thing here I can be anywhere anytime and I can be um opening myself to a source of input and it can be news it can be a text it can be oh a Spam or even people trying to fraudulently uh want you to I don't know this is joking here but uh work and and make $600,000 in a week we get those like come come work for us and we get this Promises of of a an idealic state of professional life and it's just it's coming to you so how do we stop how do we create peace in silence in the ability

se like come come work for us and we get this Promises of of a an idealic state of professional life and it's just it's coming to you so how do we stop how do we create peace in silence in the ability to go back I love what you said about discipline with a disciplined approach to creating a a moment of Harmony that you are okay to be with yourself and being okay with yourself you now become okay to be with others excellent point because yeah we live in a very hectic and unpredictable world and yeah we have we see so much disconnection in the age of connection right so yes yeah it's very much um like you said nowadays everything is at at our fingertips you know everything yeah bring these amazing devices anywhere we want uh but at the same time feel so lonely and so disconnected and yeah the distractions are have never been so much like the the amount of distractions is so incredible uh that we see you know people having difficulty reading books and like studying and doing especially like the the younger population yeah focusing right being able to to focus in the written language and absorb the the content without having to rely on a documentary or a video Etc you you're on mute uh yui sorry and I think it's it all goes through developing these uh these habits and yeah when people say oh I can't read and I can't focus I can't do that you know if if we start we mentioned like finding this inner peace I think if we bring to like U something a good reading perhaps you know let's gra grab a book that's a good good book and and and dedicate five minutes every day if you can't do more do five minutes every day and then all of a sudden you're going to be doing 10 and then do a prayer like one minute reserve one minute to find inner peace inner silence and thank God like Express gratitude so these things the idea here is to start small when we want to develop these habits from a behavioristic standpoint yeah we want to start small with achievable measurable goals and know things are IR relevant to

ngs the idea here is to start small when we want to develop these habits from a behavioristic standpoint yeah we want to start small with achievable measurable goals and know things are IR relevant to us so the the idea is finding this inner peace is not going to it's going to at least going to be very hard to start with okay I'm going to meditate for one hour every day and I'm going to read for two hours every day you know like don't try lofty goals my recommendation is try something small except set aside five minutes of your day to read something you know that's going to be productive to your own well-being you know some Spirit there's so many spiritist books or books on psychology whatever it is that's going to be helpful to you read one of Joanna d'angela book for five minutes every day day yeah yeah and then you start to develop that habit and all of a sudden that inner peace you're talking about that inner Sanctuary that we're taking care of that Emanuel so emphasizes you know so emphasizes so much it's it's gonna start to come gradually you know and and fostering that and feeding it as is as if we're like nurturing a small plant a small seed that's going to start to grow and that's yeah that's how we should think of it I think I I love I love the the the word that you use the S building a sanctuary and it's a gift that uh you can give we can give to ourselves right a gift of uh a peace a gift of uh uh and and and no judgment here right in our case I think both of us are evid readers So reading a book comes as a natural selection but it it could be just uh I don't know I I have my cup of coffee here right give me a cup of tea just take a moment to be in silence and and and drink that cup of coffee and just take the moment to to be with with ourselves without having to have that intrusion and TV movies books they're okay right they're okay and we're not GNA destroy those right absolutely it's about it's about finding a better use of the time I think not necessarily just throwing everything out

ovies books they're okay right they're okay and we're not GNA destroy those right absolutely it's about it's about finding a better use of the time I think not necessarily just throwing everything out the window you know because and I always say this people like I haven't read one one book the entire year and said if you if you read one page every day yes for the entire for an entire year you're gonna you're gonna read 365 Pages which is the average page length of most books out there yeah so you can say you read one book by the end of the year if you read one page every day and that's such a small effort if you think about it's such a small time commitment yeah it's very much doable but it requires that discipline re Ires that consistency you know that Joanna Emmanuel Andre Lise all these spiritual benefactors talk about yeah absolutely absolutely I I think you're you're You're On Target here but um because um let's pretend um I am your patient I'm not but let's pretend Yi I'm your patient and I come to you suffering and and you as a clinician you can see classic classic signs of OCD what would you tell me that could help me in in in in just a few minutes few better what are the things that perhaps you can um discuss to somebody who's suffering right now yeah so from a clinical standpoint at least in the United States here uh when we're when we're talking clinical interventions for OCD the most commonly used is CBT which stands for cognitive behavior therapy G be working you know with the thoughts the emotions the behavior which is very much the crooks of OCD if we think about the obsessions the thoughts and the compulsory behaviors so like the thoughts and the behaviors so talk therapy right talk therapy as some may refer to it or no it is a type of thought talk therapy but it's very much um it's very like applicable very very much uh applicable to the day-to-day I think that a lot of the times when we think of talk therapy we have that Freudian version of somebody lying in a

very much um it's very like applicable very very much uh applicable to the day-to-day I think that a lot of the times when we think of talk therapy we have that Freudian version of somebody lying in a couch and the therapist of behind just taking notes while they look at the ceiling and do free association and again the movie is about their doodling right the the the I I'm serious as I'm talking to you all the images from past movies come into my mind of what is this I told you there's a misrepresentation on so many different angles my profession but but the thing with CBT is very much a collaborative approach and with somebody bring into OCD specifically this idea that we're going to be treating know the the the approaching the thoughts the compository behaviors and all of those things one of the things that I'll tell you that brings relief when people um come with OCD and they are unaware perhaps that they have OCD or they think they they have but they don't or they they you know are going to start treating it knowing more about the condition is very helpful so we call that psycho education so providing psycho education as far as you know what's the percentage of people in the United States that suffer from this this more common in males or females at what age like these types even these types of statistical information people can appreciate because often times and this is applicable to I think every disorder cross the map that I've seen is people often feel like oh I'm not the only one that they often suffering from this there's there's treatment for that you know we see that a lot with like I said other conditions autism being one of but the idea of you know having this this sort of understanding like okay so there is a name for this there is there is there are symptoms there is a criteria there is a treatment for that and specifically with OCD when we're talking CBT like I said one type of CBT um intervention that we do is called uh exposure response prevention I don't

re is a criteria there is a treatment for that and specifically with OCD when we're talking CBT like I said one type of CBT um intervention that we do is called uh exposure response prevention I don't want to be too technical but the idea is we're going to be lowering the amount of times that gradually that they're doing the compensatory Behavior because they're going to see that the result are still the same if they wash their hands two times versus a 100 times yeah you know so in a very simple nutshell that's that's no no this is this is this is this is really important but uh what comes to my mind as you're speaking about and thank you Yi for for sharing with us uh uh the what what are the things of the steps that you you do when you see somebody with OCD but to me it it just highlights that is a partnership right it's a partnership and number one but the the other component of it as a partnership it really requires trust right definitely and and trust that uh I really need to again A caricature here but uh to wash my hands three times uh no you don't right why not and and that really delving into your thought processes and your intellectual ability to analyze the situation and be able to extricate the composure or the behavior right that that that that uh that requires you to do multiple times yes given task so it's really rationalized what are you what you are achieving and if I go back to the the the large uh impact that the pandemic did I I do know that for example U and I know this is very personal example that someone I know um we just had to turn off the TV turn off TV that was as simple as that the the growing and uh frightful this is early days of course uh growth of the uh covid patients and and the inability for the health care providers good globally to respond uh either by enough beds and hospitals etc etc provided such a source of discomfort that just turn off the TV turn off TV right and and and so I think sometimes we need to do some things as drastic as that right yeah and I I I

nd hospitals etc etc provided such a source of discomfort that just turn off the TV turn off TV right and and and so I think sometimes we need to do some things as drastic as that right yeah and I I I don't I don't know if is even that drastic because what you're doing is you're eliminating the trigger so being more technical with the words it's a very good you know it's a simple rather simple intervention just to like to to eliminate that trigger because yeah it is true like we all we all especially with the pandemic that's one that comes to our minds right because it was a couple of years ago it's very like recent still and and it definitely increased the anxiety spiked the anxiety of everybody everybody was nobody was impervious to that you know because we live in a society we all saw what was happening it was very much not understand like the virus and everything was like where is this coming from how it's what do we do are we how are we really safe and if you think about OCD you know we' been talking about the fear of contamination but there's like different types as well and I think that yeah it in our conversation regarding Joan I think what good connection with understanding other aspects you know perhaps where the spiritual aspects that can connect with OCD when we think about you know like the OCD regarding uh having harmful thoughts towards someone or like uh religious obsessions or hoarding obsessions they're like different different types of unwanted uh thoughts and obsessions that can uh come to someone that perhaps is like a resolve conflicts or something else you know I think yeah interesting we bring that up as well yeah so so as we're approaching the end of our time together y uh I'm I'm thinking if we if we come here and we're saying that yes one of the root cause one of many it may be unresolved inner conflicts um how do we go by resolving those inner conflicts because uh uh prayer and meditation may not be the right tools for that how do we how do we do this because I have some

be unresolved inner conflicts um how do we go by resolving those inner conflicts because uh uh prayer and meditation may not be the right tools for that how do we how do we do this because I have some some thoughts but I would love to hear from you I think I think it all it all depends on what it is necessarily the obsession like the sity I think it's there's a few factors to consider but if I were to give like a blank statements sure prayer the meditation the the habits that we often don't think about like you said eating sleeping people often don't realize how important it is to all mental health conditions Point yeah yeah for us to have you know to have a balanced sleep and diet there are so many people with symptoms of inattention that they think they have ADHD when in fact what they do is they have sleep deprivation and is as simple as that of course some do have ADHD but the idea you know seeking like I said seeking treatment psychological treatment uh there's different types of therap we mentioned CBT but there's other types of therapy that even can incorporate the like this the Mind Body Spirit connection even uh that can help somebody with OCD because of these unresolved conflicts you know so so yeah Psychiatry there's so many different ways to approach uh like the same problem yeah and and I'm going to flip back to the spiritual connection um spiritism um there's a lot in in spiritism that we can uh discuss here in in discussing the obsession and the obsession being a connection to um you know your past your past life your your uh spiritual influences Etc we're not going to have time today to talk about it but uh that's when this enormous body of work that discusses that from a spiritual Viewpoint uh goes back to the whole idea of prayer and meditation right so it's not just an overs simplistic uh uh type of a goto for everything it is uh tremendously helpful for all of us to to to to seek uh not just a moment of quiet of meditation but a moment of connection

t's not just an overs simplistic uh uh type of a goto for everything it is uh tremendously helpful for all of us to to to to seek uh not just a moment of quiet of meditation but a moment of connection to our spirituality uh connection to the Divine through prayer in in in using um your faith and faith is ultimately right Yuri uh What uh what is a testament of that uh uh faith that what seems to be so chaotic and out of control is indeed controllable and there is this Divine Mercy that will not leave you alone in in distress in the moments of distress against this very very complex very difficult world no I agree and and in the end if we think Joanna Emanuel like all these other authors it all goes back to the mind yes it all goes back to you know Joanna says the mind being this fertile ground yeah for what you know like how do we express that these unresolved conflicts there's and we can discuss at some other point like how obsessions spiritual obsessions can impact somebody's OCD or like a Trauma from a past life that's coming back now and then childhood yeah right we try to treat it but it's it's the the root cause is so much deeper and without the spiritual understanding of the idea of you know how we connect with the spirit world how we uh have this this multiple lives that we have had The Reincarnation idea like without con factoring those variables it becomes an unsolvable puzzle because like where is this coming from how are these thoughts coming to my head but it all goes back to the mind to this inner Temple that Emanuel also says that we must take care of we must you know use it well and keep it you know like clean and organized so we can connect with with our spirituality with ourselves and with God yeah I just want to to leave everyone here if you are suffering from OCD or if you have a close friend or dear one who is going through that uh you may want to to seek help um but also um in in our own lives let's try planning and preparing as much as possible to di mitigate to diminish

a close friend or dear one who is going through that uh you may want to to seek help um but also um in in our own lives let's try planning and preparing as much as possible to di mitigate to diminish the impacts of uh uh stress or right anxiety and for example I I mentioned moving moving to new home which can become such a a beautiful uh step in our lives it's our first home or you're moving to a new city and it's closer to perhaps your children's and your grandchildren uh this all hypothetical of course but uh if you're moving there let's try to uh plan I'm a project manager so this is my my go-to uh tool but let's let's create a timeline let's create uh what are the key milestones for you to achieve that what are the tasks that you need to do so by breaking down this enormous activity that triggers uh not only fear anxiety and uh also OCD let's let's make it very um manageable uh achievable right and uh provide that a better sense of control any other uh maybe any other tools that you can quickly uh give to everyone here I think you you I was going to mention that word but you mentioned right at the end I think it summarized everything the sense of control because of control predictable even if we're moving to a new house our dream house yes we don't know the future there's so many things we can't control that somebody's GNA come install something and they're going to redo the floors or we're goingon to move in how is the moving going to be are they're going to break anything in the truck there's so many things that can pop up and like spke that anxiety so if whatever we can control when we can bring a sense of control okay I'm gonna do one task per day I'm gonna break it in smaller pieces you know like you were saying so so eloquently before that is already gonna no that already helps you know we say we say to Foster the sense of control in an otherwise uncontrollable very unpredictable world so whatever little control we can do to help lower that anxiety definitely let's let's work on

know we say we say to Foster the sense of control in an otherwise uncontrollable very unpredictable world so whatever little control we can do to help lower that anxiety definitely let's let's work on that yeah so me and my OCD we can say we got this we got this we got this there there there are ways out of that yes very good well Yi than thank you it's it's such a pleasure maybe we could come back again and and explore this subject further I'd love to to hear from you on this and many other uh discussions that we have in our program I I appreciate you I appreciate everyone who's here with us and we'll see you next time thanks everyone