Ep 128 - Awaken the Self: The Journey Beyond the Shadow

Hello everyone, welcome to psychology and spirituality a bridge to better life discussion. During our weekly episodes, we explore this intersection of spirituality and psychology. And as a result, we are able to capture timeless wisdom contained in both disciplines. I'd like to welcome all of you who joined us today and invite you to this space where inner truth can meet our daily lives. I'm your host Marcia Trojanu and with me is Yuri Castro who is again joining us in this exploration of many amazing wisdoms pearls of wisdom right Yi but today I want to invite him to get into a very interesting uh different and interesting exploration which is to lead into reflections of this profound journey A journey that is really not across time, not across space, but a journey inward toward the self or really the conquest of the self, which is a topic inspired by the wisdom of spiritual author Joanna D'Angelus. Yudi, as I was reflecting on the topic, I just kept coming up with several questions that I hope you can address with me today. So, for example, have you ever felt or actually know someone that felt as if they're repeating the same emotional patterns time over time? Or have you ever wondered why in some other case completely different questions but uh some somehow we have all that external outward success or even inward spiritual practices but it just feels like peace evades us. Peace is just out of reach that horizon that we try to get it and it's not there. What if the key Yudi is not really mean external values, right? But the key is contained deeply buried within us in the layers perhaps of our psyche in the maybe unhealed parts of our history and in the shadow that we have all somehow culturally educationally or whatever right we've been taught to fear. So shall we begin today's episode by breaking down some of the questions so we can bring clarity and compassion to our fears and inner truths. What do you think? >> Absolutely. First and foremost, hello everyone, whoever and whenever uh you're

ng down some of the questions so we can bring clarity and compassion to our fears and inner truths. What do you think? >> Absolutely. First and foremost, hello everyone, whoever and whenever uh you're watching this or listening to this. I think those are some very interesting um ideas for us to talk about here. as you're talking um it I ended up thinking about how Joanna D'Angelus whom you already mentioned >> she often says during her works that the essential objective of earthly existence meaning the existence here on earth in this specific state of of our evolution is to know ourselves. So the one the person's uh objective the essential objective is to know oneself and as you mentioned I think very well Marcia a lot of the times we don't find peace or we don't find an a little bit of happiness which is we know it's still impossible and it's all of with all of its what it's encompasses >> to have right now in this existence but we don't find that peace because we're running away from things we running away from the daunting task and the daunting challenge of looking inward of knowing ourselves. >> I love what you're saying. Right. So we somehow and and our ego is actually a master in that to create those uh escape mechanism, right? And as a result, we end up running away from ourselves. Right? That's what you call the daunting task to know ourselves. And I always think Judy that uh to do that to confront ourselves actually in a very peaceful manner requires above all courage but also compassion. Right? compassion towards ourselves, compassion towards the state that we are in, compassion towards others because others are also in a state of where of development of development of their own selves as well. And I and I think you mentioned something interesting also in the beginning this idea that if if we've run away from incorporating the shadow from understanding the shadow then we find ourselves in what you know Joanna also talks about this state of >> uh like the conscience that is asleep.

if if we've run away from incorporating the shadow from understanding the shadow then we find ourselves in what you know Joanna also talks about this state of >> uh like the conscience that is asleep. >> So it's something that be that becomes almost like a cycle as you're alluding to in the beginning of this you know sleep consciousness that goes into this cycle of just doing um the organic needs. So you know eating, sleeping, having sex and then rinse and repeat. So it goes on this cycle and what we find is that the person that's going on this no cycle only paying attention to the organic needs and not really trying to find psychological spiritual meaning what ends up happening is they become unhappy because they're running away from that task. Would you agree? >> Yes. It's like something's missing. there's that uh the gap the void I don't know but I'm doing it all right uh on on on many many ways um as you know we have become such a distracted society uh a human race that is uh so distracted and anything distracts us from TV to radio to magazines this is I'm dating myself but perhaps 50 years ago those were at some point called the evils of brainwashing one, right? And voom put us today where we are. And those are easy to to to to deal with because right now and I'm looking and I don't have it with me. Uh, interesting enough, but the the so-called mobile device is that it's almost attached to our hands wherever we go and it's there. And even the expectation that people have that if they ping you, if you will, with some uh funny commentary, etc., There's the expectation that you will immediately respond and or how we're always responding to stimuli from the beautiful people. I if we think about it right the the the curated the edited the the best uh superficially speaking at least the best of the best according to some sort of uh beauty criteria or the criteria of what is success all the status symbols and we become consumers of it all and we become more and more

aking at least the best of the best according to some sort of uh beauty criteria or the criteria of what is success all the status symbols and we become consumers of it all and we become more and more distracted. So instead of spending the time doing what we need to do, we look everywhere else. It's the perfect storm. U technology has mastered those external types of stimuli, right? it mastered uh social media among many other channels or ways of distraction exist and they're better and better capturing us and the more we do it the farther away we are from ourselves. But you know, back to Joanna because I think uh you you mentioned some things that are quite interesting and I believe uh Yodi that Jon of the Angels really >> shed light in in in in this subject right that we're talking about which is the journey uh inward and um and she talks uh a lot using this term the conquest of the self. I I I I like it more of the instead of the conquest of the self calling uh perhaps that inner transformation that inner journey the self-discovery but anyways but she says that uh this inward journey is not only possible despite the fact that we said it requires courage and compassion. She Jonah the angel says it is essential. I think you use the word essential right essential for healing for happiness for a sense of integrity. But uh I wanted to ask you Yuri why are we even talking about the self? Why is it even important? Can we talk maybe uh embedded in this idea of the importance of talking about oursel with the concept perhaps or the question perhaps about who is really living our lives? This is a little philosophical if I may. Right, Yudi? Is it our conscious self or our conditioned instincts? Right. more of the primitive mind which you you you said it so well that almost animallike type of instincts to survive which really uh is more in the realm of eating sleeping seeking shelter reproducing repeat right what do you think who who's in control >> I think if we if we look back to as we

f instincts to survive which really uh is more in the realm of eating sleeping seeking shelter reproducing repeat right what do you think who who's in control >> I think if we if we look back to as we were evoling evolving as spirits and we still are evolving. >> The more we evolve, the more the spirit overcomes the matter in a way has more control over the matter and the psychology goes with that as well. The more primitive we were, the less psychologically aware we were, the less psychologically knowledgeable we were and we will still be way more knowledgeable, way more aware, way more in control. You use this word and I I I like it. We will be way more in control of our own realities as this process moves along in the evolutionary let's call it ladder in the evolutionary staircase >> that we all have. So before when as the more primitive we are the more we have what Joanna again the the the terminology she uses as sleep consciousness to then it transitions to this sort of semi asleep consciousness where there is a a higher level of awakening of the unconscious mind and when we're talking about the self we're talking about the planitude of the spirit the self with capital S and we're talking about all the integration of all these things and which is in the end the purpose of our own evolution as spirits to reach the state of of planitude. So right now we're still very much >> bound to these uh primary automatisms or or this you know these automatic processes because >> robotic almost right it's just it's such a we are we are put into automatic or autopilot that we forget to be in the moment right >> yes and we become also very reactionary if we think about it that's also part of it the more control we're going to gain over those processes those psychological and of course spiritual processes, the more we're going the less we're going to be reactionary in the sense of just acting based on impulse, based on instinct. And we're going to be acting way more than reacting based on higher

cesses, the more we're going the less we're going to be reactionary in the sense of just acting based on impulse, based on instinct. And we're going to be acting way more than reacting based on higher sentiments such as you know love of all the virtues of patience, charity, tolerance and that is that is the end goal. But we reach there once we start to look inward, once we start to find the meaning, you know, the essential meaning of our lives. >> Yeah. Yeah. So, so I love what where you're going and uh it's almost like can we can we rewind and talk more about this this this this idea about uh you know reaction versus action? meaning uh if if we start to to really think about it, Yodi, that reactionary, if you will, life is one that is of a passive state and only reacts against an external against stimuli, right? External stimulus in this case. uh and then I'll I'll do something, I'll feel something, I will uh behave in this way. Whereas the actionary or acting as you mentioned may be one that is intentional. I'm here. I don't have to wait for things to happen to me, but I happen to myself and I happen to things. Does this make sense? Even the language makes sense. Okay. >> Yes. And I'm also thinking if we can take a step further, it's not only the reactionary from the from the standpoint of u behavioral but we can also think in the sense of the higher sentiments. You know the reactionary part of our is still the is still very much in play because >> we often think okay I'm only going to forgive this person if they ask for forgiveness. I'm only going to forgive if they forgive first. I'm only going to send if they say first. What is that if not a reaction? We're we're waiting for someone to do something in order for us to then do it. >> Yeah. And and I we can even pause uh perhaps to to think about what you said, right? Because even uh you're talking the higher sentiments, right? the feelings uh pure feelings that we are all in the in the essence of our humanity as immortal spirits that we

about what you said, right? Because even uh you're talking the higher sentiments, right? the feelings uh pure feelings that we are all in the in the essence of our humanity as immortal spirits that we have. But when we also start to think yeah feelings but in between a reactionary behavior and that higher feelings, higher sentiment, there is also this thing called emotions. And in the emotional landscape, a lot of it that emotional response can be still reactionary, right? I am reacting to uh a a uh something that I feel is an act of violence, therefore I react with anger, right? Or with the same act of violence, I act with fear. Right? So those are still reactionary to something outside of me. >> And it's very interesting when we start to think what about you Yuri? What about you Mercia? What about all of us who are here today? How what is it that is coming from within which is quite frankly we say S with a capital S and um since we're referencing Joanna so much today uh Joanna explains that when in her body of work in her psychological series of books she always references the self with capital S equals the immortal soul. Yes. The spirit that you already mentioned, right? The spirit that is immortal. The spirit that lives through uh many well we can say many lives but it's really one life but many corporeal existence uh upon uh physical birth and physical death. Right? But that self is the conductor, the mothership if you will, that conducts us for this this goals of happiness of uh really um having that greatest achievement which is a paradox of it all. Right? If you think about it, our greatest achievement is to become truly ourselves, which we're already there. So, Yes. >> Yes. Yes. So, I I just find it quite interesting and um often and uh we can talk about our friend, right? A quote unquote friend or ourselves. I'm just kidding here, Judy. But uh uh we we can think of uh ourselves and uh maybe just pause to ask when was the last time we sat still even you know just the notion of

unquote friend or ourselves. I'm just kidding here, Judy. But uh uh we we can think of uh ourselves and uh maybe just pause to ask when was the last time we sat still even you know just the notion of stillness is becoming more and more foreign to all of us. Right? When was the last time we sat still and we could do things like we could drink a cup of tea, a cup of water, we can just uh sit still and look inward. >> Absolutely. That's a that's an excellent question especially as you were referring to before in this very chaotic and hectic >> world that everything tries to grab our attention. Everything is geared and made and created and tuned to get our attention to drive us away from looking at ourselves to like pondering to meditating to thinking to just being quiet. Even silence has become very very rare. >> Yeah. Yeah. There is I just remember I think it was uh Isaac Azimov I think many years ago I I was still a teenager. There is a book uh and I just still remember where he talked about the idea of the human brain of course at the time was the future uh could not deal with silence. Therefore, it noise but noise in terms of either uh talk right or music is omniresent and and quite frankly isn't it right I I I just uh think about let's say going to the airport especially I'm old here so I I I embrace my my age but uh when we go to airports It's that everybody has a headset and and if you go to on a train or if you go on public u space uh could be drinking coffee if you're alone or even if you're not alone but that that thing of you know inputs into a year it's it's present everywhere you go. Therefore uh being facing you know, being in a situation that we're having to face silence can be quite daunting. And I wonder if there's any symbolism to it. You I don't know if you've thought about it, but uh the symbolism of silence perhaps equals um isolation or loneliness. uh states of mind that are actually culturally speaking not um accepted anymore right I don't know what are your

ht about it, but uh the symbolism of silence perhaps equals um isolation or loneliness. uh states of mind that are actually culturally speaking not um accepted anymore right I don't know what are your thoughts >> because the idea yeah the I think the idea of silence is very rare because our brains are getting trained >> to always have to always be paying attention to something and that something's not silence >> that something is not nothing it's something it's not nothing >> so we're always jumping from one thing to the other. Nowadays, we have >> Mhm. >> these mobile devices as you mentioned which are personalized worlds. >> Yeah, >> that's what they are because they're they're they're personalized to each person and they're very affordable nowadays for the most part. >> So, it's it's this epidemic of like you said people with the headphones and like everything >> is catch is trying to grab our attention and we're we're just getting used to it. It's becoming the norm now because a lot of the times when there's silence in the conversation when there's silence >> even staying home in silence >> becomes something you know that people shy away from they they try they try not they try to avoid >> because often times too being in silence in silence is the answer to a lot of our problems as we learned with Joanna and with so many other authors as we can sort of connect with God we can connect with the higher spirits we can connect with ourselves This is again a conversation about looking inward. And if I'm very anxious, if I don't like what I'm going to what with uh if I don't like what I see there, >> I'm going to try to stay away from moments where I'm going to be forced to be literally with myself. >> Yeah. Yeah. That's that's very interesting to to think about it, right? This this uh silence that uh I don't know. Um I'm going to reference something that uh again was a long long time ago so I don't know the reference uh uh to provide here but uh the idea that the brain abores

is uh silence that uh I don't know. Um I'm going to reference something that uh again was a long long time ago so I don't know the reference uh uh to provide here but uh the idea that the brain abores void or the vacuum I don't know if you studied or if you if you encounter that. So from that perspective and this is uh juxtaposing to the conversation we have about silence and connecting to the sacred to divine within right but cognitively speaking and and from a um neuroscientific uh findings is that the brain itself abores it it just it's terrified about anything that has emptiness. Therefore, we whenever in the absence of a narrative, we um create those narratives ourselves. So, it's very interesting uh when we we hear about the my truth, your truth, and the real truth because between one event, my brain creates a narrative of the things that I don't know and you too. Therefore, it becomes a multifaceted view of the world, a multifaceted view of events. And of course, as we spoke earlier in this reactionary um propensity to to to life, then we we now start to to have just emotional response to a reality that we create, a myth perhaps or a a a fable instead of reality. I just thought it's it's interesting how All of it connects, right? >> And you're mentioning the brain abhoring these things. Also, it's closely related to that is this idea that >> we we can't be bored anymore. Boredom has become something almost extin extinct or we're trying to make extinct. So, we see not only adults but also children. Look at how how technology is affecting children nowadays where they cannot they don't know how to be bored anymore. And if they're bored, there's something that's going to be given in their hands or something that the adults are going to do to >> help them get away from the boredom. And then they grow up, >> they don't know how to be bored. So their their brains are always seeking constant stimulation. >> Yeah. But going back to Joanna like in linking with this idea

the boredom. And then they grow up, >> they don't know how to be bored. So their their brains are always seeking constant stimulation. >> Yeah. But going back to Joanna like in linking with this idea >> si we're talking about silence we're talking about ignoring like to look inward to look at ourselves to see what we still need to improve and what we can still improve. She mentioned something very very powerful I think where in the in the book in the search of truth where she talks about how those who ignore themselves or those who you know let's let's say they try to get away from from looking inward they walk around with insecurity and emotionally ill. So she's talking about emotionally ill and one of the things that happens from this is they put blames onto others. They're trying to find external um solutions. That's what they're trying to find, external solutions. >> It's almost like, sorry to interrupt you, but it's almost like outsourcing the pain, right? I cannot uh uh be responsible uh or even curious about looking for the root cause of this pain. So, it's it's easier to look elsewhere, >> right? and and if I don't find anybody else to outsource it to >> one of the the the resources is then to numb it to distract myself from the pain from looking at that part of myself that I know that I need to change that I have deep in my conscience this notion that this is a barrier I will have to overcome. I'm going to have to work on this part of myself. That's why she says that those who know themselves and we're going back to you know to Delos and Socrates know thyself which >> love it. Yeah. >> Some which is something you know that that perpetuated through millennia now that she says that those who know themselves they're possessors of wisdom and they're you know one step away from self-illumination. I think that's what she says. So and this is very powerful if we think about it. It is. It is. It is. So, back to the question, why is it so hard to put ourselves in in

ep away from self-illumination. I think that's what she says. So and this is very powerful if we think about it. It is. It is. It is. So, back to the question, why is it so hard to put ourselves in in that position to follow Socrates as Socrates mentioned to us, right? Uh we we must know ourselves. But, uh why is it so hard? And and who's truly in charge? Who's in charge? You what? What? What can we say? Who's in charge? Is it the the machine or not? And and I I I may, if I put a a little uh squirrel squirrel moment here. Um when we go back to the push and pull, right? This uh um uh almost like this architecture of how our societies uh are creating. so many um inputs, right? So there's this this this idea of distracted world because there's so many uh sources for stimulus for our brain. But if we go back a little bit like go a step a couple of steps uh from from this discussion yi it is also very connected to the type of society that we live on and what am I talking about we're talking about you know you and I both live in the US so it's a individualistic societ society. It is a capitalist society which means a production society. But but but we don't produce as in manufacturing as much as we produce uh inputs or or uh tidbits in the service reality. So you are a someone who provides a service, right? I am the same different fields but we we provide a service and the service that we create or we provide in this production uh type of society requires my brain now to to to pay attention to do something with that information. The problem that we have if we go back now no longer 30 years but perhaps 50 years from now uh 50 years earlier or even a hundred years earlier when uh this society the US or many other societies were mostly say stew agrarian work was in that you know um some up some down you got up and you worked right? >> Yeah. >> At sundown, wash your hands and you you you kind of rest for the until the next day. Uh today that's not the same. We wake up and the first thing we do is we

u got up and you worked right? >> Yeah. >> At sundown, wash your hands and you you you kind of rest for the until the next day. Uh today that's not the same. We wake up and the first thing we do is we get that uh amazing little thing called a mobile device. And even though we're not producing anything, we're equally engaged as if we were >> right. >> So that that the brain always connected works as if we are working all the time. So instead of say eight hours work, we're now working >> way more >> 20 hours a day many times. and our children and we're talking about as early as elementary age children because they have access to mobile devices at that age >> they're also working their brains are working therefore and I'm just thinking out loud here Yuri um it's almost like we're becoming a society of burned out individuals we're so over stimulated created that we there's nothing else out there. >> There's nothing else out there. And also there's the search for more and more and more. But there's going to there's a ceiling. >> There's the limit. Our bodies have limits, you know. And often times, like I said, that's why I I mentioned that we try to numb it or we try to find distractions and distractions and what doesn't distract me anymore. I'm going to try to find something else. and is always jumping from one thing to the other with this lingering feeling of dissatisfaction with the reality. Yeah, >> that's something that I think is very important for us to realize and when we're talking about knowing ourselves, >> which is one of the one of the the greatest challenges perhaps of us, especially in this day and age where we're we're so moved away from silence, from having uh quiet time, from having things that we can really look inward and reflect and try to change. >> One of these challenges and we talked about already is the shadow. this idea. Now bring a little bit more to the psychological aspect here. This >> the shadow like this this denied and unknown part of the personality which is

nd we talked about already is the shadow. this idea. Now bring a little bit more to the psychological aspect here. This >> the shadow like this this denied and unknown part of the personality which is everything that we >> we denying ourselves but that remains active unconsciously. everything that we we do not accept but that our nature insists >> in revealing in bringing to the surface those things the shadow which >> as Joanna also talks about so much this idea that our challenge is to >> um not defeat it defeated but al but instead integrated consciously and harmoniously. >> Yeah. And and and when we when we talk about the shadow in general and uh and the need uh the idea that we we really should integrate, right, or individuate to to use a union term, >> right? Um I I I think we should all agree that uh um that sense of self uh uh conquest, if you will, that uh really reaching or achieving what we need to do, does not mean that we should erase who we are, right? It's the quite the opposite. It is a looking in with courage and compassion but acknowledging the whole of we are and of course this this who we are it's still fragmented right it's a it's a dual uh type of reference where we we look at things always in in in I am I am not right >> but when we start to to look at the The endgame, if you will, is is that integrity, that individuation, the whole of all of our parts. It would include um all of our fears. I can imagine all of the things that we perhaps are you mentioned denied aspects of ourselves but I I'm even thinking the aspects of ourselves that we failed and oh my goodness we are ashamed of right or even um you the unresolved traumas all of it >> conflicts yeah >> right and the the ugly side of you and me, right? The ugly side that is no longer uh that is very far from that public persona that we cultivate so well. >> But we also learn which is ties very well with this that there the the law of progress is unstoppable is immutable. >> Yeah, >> it happens. So the idea is you know the

na that we cultivate so well. >> But we also learn which is ties very well with this that there the the law of progress is unstoppable is immutable. >> Yeah, >> it happens. So the idea is you know the self when you're when you're talking about the conflict the traumas these things you know Joanna talks about how the self develops through uh these she call existential efforts I thought that was so interesting the terminology existential efforts that help awake the the dormant treasures because otherwise we just go through this process of >> uh hibernation where you know the the awakening comes the awakening usually comes she says in the form of something something painful. There is a painful phenomena that shakes the person up and in sort of like propels them forward when they have been trying just in the state of hibernation in the state of denial in the state of everything that is not really progressing in the in the with the pace that the individual can progress. Mhm. And uh can you for our audience can you tell us what is behind this idea of the law of progress Yodi if you don't mind? >> So the idea behind the law of progress this is drawing from teachings from spiritism. So we're talking along our deck we're talking of all of all others. This idea that our basically in a very simple terms that the spirit is made the spirits the immortal part of ourselves which is definitely not our bodies our souls our spirits >> they are made for planetude they are made to progress they have been progressing and they will continue to progress and when we try to stop progress we are propelled forward because we cannot stop progress even by making mistakes we are learning things about ourselves we're going through process of reparation of those mistakes and that in itself is a learning >> process for the soul which is progress. >> Yeah. Yeah. Beautiful. Thank you. Thank you for sharing. >> And it's important too Marcia if I may just add one thing here too with the the process and the progress and this idea

which is progress. >> Yeah. Yeah. Beautiful. Thank you. Thank you for sharing. >> And it's important too Marcia if I may just add one thing here too with the the process and the progress and this idea of developing know like the through the self through existential efforts. >> This idea that the journey is not easy. The journey is definitely not easy but we don't we don't reach the top of the mountain without having to put some effort to reach there. Nobody >> is teleported there. Nobody helicopter sitting in a chair just very comfortably. No, we have to anybody who reaches anything uh like in in in life and we're talking just very narrowly about this life or anybody any spirit that we see that has walked this world that is very enlightened >> is somebody who has gone through tremendous sacrifice. There isn't one >> elevated spirit that has passed through this life through our no the earth our our very brief brief history here on this planet that has not gone through sacrifice to reach the top. >> I I love it and and uh the the thoughts that come to my mind are uh we you know if we're really honest we're not just dealing with oh all of our pain points in life. So, uh, traffic, bills to pay, deadlines to meet, right? We we are we're talking about the Olympian effort to do something >> like we've never done before and and and gain the the the gold medal for being the best and breaking all the records, etc. But uh that dealing with the shadow uh really means looking at those past behaviors and patterns, emotional reactions uh uh behavioral patterns, our fears and I I would even imagine all of those wounds like we talked about the wounded inner child that comes back and we we we have to to look at it again with compassion. and and understand that it's okay. It's okay, right? And uh those shadow aspects of ourselves um are not they do not make us monsters, right? It's it's really that authenticity, that vulnerability, that truth about who we are that invites us to love us infinitely in in all of

ects of ourselves um are not they do not make us monsters, right? It's it's really that authenticity, that vulnerability, that truth about who we are that invites us to love us infinitely in in all of the the the the good, the bad, and the ugly, all of its nuances and still to develop as >> we it's part of us. >> Yeah. >> And it's part of what makes us unique. each person, each soul in their very individual in the sense of being very unique progress that they've had so far. It it shows us it's almost like it's a trail that we leave behind, but it's always coming with us. >> That's why it's called the shadow, which is interesting because the shadow is always >> with us from a from a know a physical standpoint even if we think about any projection of light we're going to have. I think of Peter Penn when he was trying his shadow, right? Sort of like always, >> right? It's always following. It's always following us. And this idea then that it is what makes us unique. It's it's what makes us >> Yeah. >> who we are and how we got here. So we're what you're talking about makes sense >> when we look at it from the standpoint of let me see >> what I still need to what I still need to integrate what I still need to understand because something that may be uh something that may be let's say offensive to me may not be to you. So okay. Does that mean that I have some things that I need to work on that maybe you already don't and vice versa? >> I I would say uh in a very um silly if you will uh type of metaphor. It's like uh let's say um I look at myself today and say oo right I I got some funds additional budget. I'm going to undergo some slight uh change to my house. And I start to look in the ceiling. I said, I want to get uh let's say a new ceiling fan. I'm just being real silly here. And when I go to add the the ceiling, I see uh some sign that there is some weird coloring. And I said, well, I can just cover it up, hide it. That's a shadow. Or I can look it further and I and I look it further and

add the the ceiling, I see uh some sign that there is some weird coloring. And I said, well, I can just cover it up, hide it. That's a shadow. Or I can look it further and I and I look it further and I find that the insulation with the roof is is gone. Right. Yeah. And now I look further and there's infiltration and now I need to look at the roof etc. Right. So I think that the metaphor may be uh we can approach life with curiosity and or we can approach life with the that escape mechanism and try to ignore and hide. But if we approach life with curiosity, we can say could that whatever is wrong right the the change in colors in my ceiling behind the old ceiling fan. Could that be or hold a message that will lead to fixing it or in our case to healing? And I want to just uh before we close because we're we're approaching to the end of our time, Yodi, um how do we grow? How do we even begin for all of us who are interested in this discussion today? How do I even begin to, you know, to to to get to this inner um sense of achievement of conquest? What are your thoughts or can you give any any tips to everyone here? >> Yeah, I think you already mentioned a very key word actually too. You said courage and compassion, the two C's and I agree with that 100%. courage, >> compassion and from a more uh processoriented type of answer, I would say understanding the role of acceptance >> because this is the same analogy used with the roof. >> Yeah. >> If you just ignore it, if you don't accept, well, I do have an issue. I I do have a problem with my roof. I need to to fix it, the ceiling, etc. If you don't accept that, >> you're not going to know uh get repair to get a repair for it. So the idea of acceptance and to quote uh Cal Rogers another big name of of psychology >> he said that we cannot change until we thoroughly accept what we are. >> I love >> and I think that that is very that's one big tip or one big you know comment that I want to leave with this idea that along with the courage and the

ntil we thoroughly accept what we are. >> I love >> and I think that that is very that's one big tip or one big you know comment that I want to leave with this idea that along with the courage and the compassion which are almost like ingredients necessary for this mix. Yeah, >> acceptance is like in a way it's like having the recipe and following the recipe because if we don't accept >> Yeah. >> that we're not going to be able to really really >> change and improve. >> Yeah. And I I even say with acceptance uh the other word that comes to my mind here is the sense I mentioned curiosity but it's really awareness right uh looking at whatever comes to you to me to you you to all of us here present today uh but not rejecting what comes to us but actually responding to it seeking attention to it >> yes clarity Right? And if it causes pain, just be curious and and try to understand why is it causing pain, right? So maybe um I would say this is me trying to to to bring to everyone some uh and you you you correct me if I'm going someplace that is not good Yodi but uh maybe this is an invitation for all of us to to start our days um welcoming silence. So let's pledge to ourselves that I'm going to spend five minutes in silence. That's all. not more than five minutes. Uh maybe another aspect of uh this journey inward could be uh start um writing down or journaling what we are feeling without judgment of course just just plain jot down today I'm depressed today I'm anxious today I'm angry today I I am giddy with joy whatever right and Then ask ourselves, am I reacting right and if so am I reacting with fear right with whatever is the emotional response or am I seeking the truth my truth I don't know can we can we wrap it up with some final thoughts from you Yudi on on this subject. >> Absolutely. I think as a more general thought sort of sort of just understanding you know this idea of the self of knowing ourselves with capital S even >> understanding that you know human existence is going to be painful it's

re general thought sort of sort of just understanding you know this idea of the self of knowing ourselves with capital S even >> understanding that you know human existence is going to be painful it's going to be full of challenges and barriers and that's why it's so important for us to live it within a framework of you know moral and spiritual duties >> with this this these lens that truly amplify the way we see things. Otherwise, we're going to be succumbing to the automatic behaviors, the automatic, you know, actions and the reactive uh sides of ourselves. >> Yeah. No more autopilot for all of us, right? >> That's awesome. But uh we are at time and as we come to the closing seconds of our episode. I just uh hope all of us leave today with uh more than just ideas. We hope that uh you too because I certainly am can leave with a sense of um possibility right because this journey within the journey of selfconquest it's absolutely not about perfection right it's it's also not on the other spectrum not about isolation or even numbing or avoiding all those life's challenges that come to us I would say it's about engaging all of it life in all of its nuances with consciousness and uh it's about also maybe understanding those conflicts as Yudi put including every wound that we may have or even every mistake that we we we may have uh uh fell prey to um they're all part of a sacred process of becoming. So Yudi, you and I and everybody in between, we are not broken. >> We are just becoming what is our promised land, right? We're becoming what we already have the promise of being, which is the divine within. And let's not forget uh uh our shadow isn't our enemy. Uh but it's that invitation to step into the light of who we really are meant to be, that individuated that numinous self. So as we explored all those ideas about the conquest of the self um right um my final final final thought is that uh we are actually confronted Yudi with the notion that uh um this is a task that is

. So as we explored all those ideas about the conquest of the self um right um my final final final thought is that uh we are actually confronted Yudi with the notion that uh um this is a task that is for saints and for sinners right for all of us and it is a call to all of us this call to pause to reflect and beautifully maybe meet ourselves fully and honestly. So let's be gentle. Let's be compassionate. Let's be loving with ourselves. Let's be curious. Let's keep asking those deeper questions. And most of all let's all know that uh as Yuri mentioned growth is not only needed but we can even say right Yuri it's contagious because when we awaken the self we have >> yes >> we also help to to to awaken the world. So I I love the concept. So I want to say thank you Yi for being here. Thank you all of you who came to join us in this uh this discussion and um reflections right and if this is the first time that you actually are here with us listening to a program please note that these podcast is a psychology and spirituality weekly talks are based on the works by Jonah D'Angelus and we hope that you're able to consider them and expand your own thoughts around the topic. Thank you. Thank you so much, Yudi. Thank you all of our sponsors, Mel Camino, the United States Spirits Federation, the International Spiritist Council, and Brazil, the Brazilian arm of the Medical Spiritist Association. We'll be back next week with another episode. So long, Yudi. So long, everyone. >> Bye-bye, everyone. Thank you.