Ep 7 - Psychology and Spirituality | The Conscious Being - Pt 1

foreign good morning good afternoon good evening wherever you are welcome to the psychology and spirituality a bridge to a better life discussion I'm your host Marcia trejano with me are Dr anaifan Sega my good friend I will call you just out of corn goat and in Sinclair thank you so much for joining us today and today's episode uh will be focused on face I'm sorry facing Consciousness and I wanted to to let you know that this episode was brought to us by our friends at Ami Brazil Ami Brazil is an association of spiritus health professionals it was founded in 1995 and if you are interested in learning more about this organization please do visit them unfortunately I believe the site is in Portuguese it is called amebrasil.org.br uh today psychology and spirituality program is also sponsored by United States spiritus Federation the international spiritus Council and we have special contributions from many different spiritus organizations so thank you all make sure before we get started to hit subscribe if you haven't already done so if you're ready there to check out other channels you can see us at spiritus.us so welcome it is good to be here with you today we will be listening for you but as a group of friends who are here to to discuss uh psychology and spirituality we were going to talk in chat and comment on your thought-provoking ideas about business right we talked about how can we achieve a higher level of Consciousness how can we become that integral human being if you are listening if you are interested in knowing more please please please check out the following books that bring light to to this topic that we're talking today the entire human being specifically chapter eight is a good one the conscious being and The Awakening of the spirit but with that uh anahi please take it away thank you Marcia hello everybody it's a pleasure to be here with you all and my good friends and I'll be talking today so as Marcia told everybody about a man human beings actually facing consciousness

hank you Marcia hello everybody it's a pleasure to be here with you all and my good friends and I'll be talking today so as Marcia told everybody about a man human beings actually facing consciousness so how we develop our consciousness how can we be evolve as human beings how do we actually evolve as human beings and I will be talking about a wonderful book by Joanna G Angeles and in the medianship of the perida Franco and the book is called the integral human being so according to Joanna G Angeles the most important moment in human beings evolutionary process happen when they acquire consciousness and actually conscious to discern good from Evil truth from imposter right from wrong continuing on the upward March that one day will lead us all to angelitude so we need to discern all of these Facts of Life of our inner psychic life right to evolve our consciousness so when Joanna talks about the birth of consciousness she says that anthropologically and historically the balance balance survival of human beings in our society has always been linked to the idea of a central myth from which the ethical values that sustain their activities in their balance are inspired and that every time an adverse Factor interfere with human myths discrediting the one who synthesized their aspirations human beings had toward chaos and attack and disturb each one each other actually seeming to have lost their way I don't know if you my friends want to comment in that this is very actual right very real and also very in um is happening here in our modern times I don't know if you'd like to make any comments yes I would love to thank you anahi and the first one um it's actually I'm gonna open this question to to our panel here which is the idea that uh you you started by saying something that is is that idea that according you know that Joanna brings that we see very well described in spiritism so according to spiritism um in the entire body of work right we live in the world of Trials and

is is that idea that according you know that Joanna brings that we see very well described in spiritism so according to spiritism um in the entire body of work right we live in the world of Trials and expiations so from that perspective we are transitioning to what you call that state of agility right to join a deangelist so from that perspective and I love what you said uh uh you you mentioned of course this is using or referencing Joanna de Angela's words but it's the idea that the evolutionary process uh goes through from your conscience um to discern from not Discerning anything and now Discerning what is the difference between good and evil truth and untruths right and wrong so on and so forth so maybe we can talk a little bit about what does it look like do we just a flip of a of a switch do we get to become Angels do we when we when we move on right during that moments of uh uh a post-death of our bodies we become uh Saint Marcia or whatever how does it work can we talk about it and then we can perhaps tackle the idea of uh myths that you also talked about anyone would like to to talk about this this sense of evolution if you would like to comment before I answered yeah yeah I'll just say that um like everything and we can take nature as our example that everything in nature just transitions in a natural way and we also progress in a natural way we are not going to go to sleep and wake up an angel it will be a real process when we get a tree let's say an oak tree and we just have that little oak acorn you know the potential for the whole tree is there but we need to plant it and we need to look after it and it goes through the wind and it goes through the seasons and it goes growing and growing and growing until it becomes a marvelous oak tree that will last hundreds of years so we can see if we look at nature we can see examples that can guide us of how things happen and I think that our evolution is like that as well and we also are subjected to the rain and the wind and

so we can see if we look at nature we can see examples that can guide us of how things happen and I think that our evolution is like that as well and we also are subjected to the rain and the wind and all the difficulties that come our way but we we carry on developing so I think that idea it fits for me with what you look at nature and say okay so we go step by step so that also for me is very consoling because if I'm not perfect today I will not be perfect tomorrow but step by step we'll get there so it just gives us a little bit of you know takes away that anxiety of why aren't I better already why and you know why aren't I an angel now now step by step we will all get yes absolutely and and and and that idea that I was just talking the other day we just said about uh being uh work in progress right just said we are we're we are not there but we're getting there therefore let's be kind to ourselves Let's uh practice a little bit of self-love um do you want to uh comment on that on that uh notion of becoming what we're not there yet uh yes I totally agree with them it's uh step by step and um there is a paradox because the whole is inside of us and we are part of the whole the whole a totality the Transcendence God as uh if you want to call it like this um so the thing is that we are in the spirit is um knowledge we are spirits reincarnated and using this material world to evolve to learn so we are we are going to say I don't want to give everybody spoilers but anyway so we are leaving the material world right so we are in a world of um we are uh like in space and time in in time when we are here and we are in the material so we are in um a Duo uh Paradox because we are a spirit and we are matter when we are here so this Duality this um this Con constant conflict okay makes our psychic life very dual we have lots of opposites that's why Joanna tells about that we have to learn to discern good and evil for instance yes and it takes time and also we are we have to do this uh individual like

ery dual we have lots of opposites that's why Joanna tells about that we have to learn to discern good and evil for instance yes and it takes time and also we are we have to do this uh individual like individuals but also in a collective way so it takes it takes time there is a lot of history going on right the history with big age and so we need a lot of incarnations right the spirit is knowledge tells us that to go little by little as Ann said step by step we are not going to be angels in one life but we are we go step by step and we our light each time is brighter and not giving a spoilers but this means that we have we are also we are light and we are Shadow because we are spirit and matter so we have to learn at what slide and what's Shadow we have to turn on the lights within ourselves to eliminate the Shadow and you know to integrate these different parts so I think this is a wonderful metaphor that Anne brought that to be you know this big tree this you know to express all of our uh spiritual nature we have to go little by little I don't know if jusana wants to make any comments yeah I was thinking along the lines of and you know um first of all thinking how great it is for us to have a a name right so now it's not that I am a voyager not knowing where am I going to to get uh so that that there is this whole process in this whole trip that I have to be taking that I will be taking and uh it's going to take me to a safe port and along this journey I will be you know increasing in knowledge in in discernment as you said Being able through experiences separate what is good and what is bad and um and so I I think that the idea one of the points in any mentioned that it is you know be patient be patient with yourself of course um you know it's nature doesn't go by lips and Bounds and uh we we don't as well it's the whole process that that we have to go so uh this idea that um I will be coming you know or our richest state of angelitude it's quite comforting really and now I look at me

e we don't as well it's the whole process that that we have to go so uh this idea that um I will be coming you know or our richest state of angelitude it's quite comforting really and now I look at me with all my flaws but already uh learning and growing in a process and saying to myself you know what come down everything is going to be okay you will have enough time to go into this journey just go step by step you know it's baby steps awesome this is this is great can I go ahead and flip to uh what you were talking which is you you mentioned Joanna DeAngelo is introducing to us in the book The integral human being she introduces the the idea of the birth of conscious right she says that uh she said that uh oh anthropologically historically etc etc we needed we got to that moment and then you you mentioned that there is uh there is a need for uh that's that idea of a myth so before we go any further because I know you have lots and lots to talk to us and I.E but could we maybe um could you maybe tell us what are myths why are they so important can we maybe give an example of a myth or perhaps we can even as a group talk about when did we lose them what what happened but go ahead and if you don't mind great fantastic because I was going uh to Pro to tell everybody uh just to think about uh or we live in a in times very difficult times right happening a lot of things are happening and all this um we have the social medias we have these crisis uh value we say values that we don't you know sometimes we have difficulty Discerning uh what's good and not good and you know it's not that good for me so people are kind of really um sometimes they feel lost a lot of depressions a lot of anxiety nowadays all this technology and you know how do we use it how do we use it in a in an ethical way how do we use all these possibilities that technology brings us without losing ourselves without losing the connection with our inner selves okay so this is I think what Joanna says when she said I'm

how do we use all these possibilities that technology brings us without losing ourselves without losing the connection with our inner selves okay so this is I think what Joanna says when she said I'm going to answer what are myths but just for you to understand that it's so important when she says that we all peoples Of All Times need a central myth from which the ethical values that sustain their activities and their balance are inspired so imagine if we lose that but what are myths so myths are our sacred stories we can say some you know in a very simple way we have a definition for instance that it's very simple that needs are not narratives of a symbolic an imagery nature that evolve with the historical and ethnic conditions related to a given culture and that seek to explain the origin of things so imagine that we always want to know who am I what I'm doing here where I'm heading towards right and so the urge our origin and what is the purpose of everything as a psychiatrist and a psychiatrist and a normal analyst I can tell you we have been researching a lot of religions and spirituality and mental health as I told you before and we we say that people are much healthier and much more mature and psychologically speaking when they have purpose when they know what their purpose in life is you know or are and when they know what I'm doing here and when they wander at least Wonder try to find out uh okay but from where do I come where am I heading to it okay we we gave everybody spoilers because we said sometimes someday we are going to be Angels we're going to evolve so much that we are going to be you know really like beings but how do we get there as you as you're wandering so people need this Central myths you know they need um okay in our culture in a given culture in a given time of History okay the the this group of people what are where do they come from how do we explain that they are um that they are here what are their purpose you know so the things that when we lose that for

istory okay the the this group of people what are where do they come from how do we explain that they are um that they are here what are their purpose you know so the things that when we lose that for uh in Joanna said because of adverse factors she used this a word that interfere with human myths with our sacred stories band uh then maybe we we start heading toward chaos and attack each other you know and disturb each other as many times we see nowadays people some people doing to each other so like Wars things like that actually in the history of human human kind has always been like that we have some uh very deep crisis Wars and fires this and that and then people have to learn something about that and create a new myth because otherwise they destroy each other again each step as you say individually and also Collective collectively takes us to another a higher step and we learn that it's not okay you know to do bad things to each other it's not okay War we need peace we need love that we have to forgive our enemies and all that the gospel for instance tells us right so we have different light beings teachers as Joanna like teachers as and said one once to me that can't bring us you know and to remind us and to bring us back to the path of growing together and so uh I would say that uh jungian um psychologist we call deaths I call it and Joanna talks a lot about young young Concepts right because Jung talks about the soul brings back the soul to psychology in academic terms so uh and we know that for you needs and dreams like in fairy tales for instance they are in the very deep part of the unconscious that Jung calls the collective unconscious so when we talk it when we are talking about uh myths we are talking about a shared sacred history why a story why is that story sacred because as Joanna tells us it contains the values the sacred values the sacred material let's say psychic material that the the group of people that are in the in this culture has learned together

red because as Joanna tells us it contains the values the sacred values the sacred material let's say psychic material that the the group of people that are in the in this culture has learned together the we could say the spiritual path that we share as a culture and and also I think it's very important that one of uh Joanna's sentence in this book that she says After the Storm so after we all get in a crisis it's uh undestroyed remnants emerge giving rise to a new ideation and a creative myth appears filling the Gap laughed by the previous one that's why we evolve little by little uh remember that I talked about the Paradox and Duality when we are here right in matter so the thing is that this destruction and rebirth like death and rebirth are ancient themes archetypal themes in the in the depths of our Psych I don't know if this is very complicated and please interrupt me I will right now like before we move on because there's so much to unpack here everyone so if you will uh I love what you're going and and and uh stitching together uh Joanna DeAngelis and Carl Jung and uh any any other um uh you know experts and uh thought uh uh those who brought us such revolutionary thoughts in Psychology in-depth psychology right but what I wanted to to perhaps is ask here before we move on because you you use the word archetype so let's talk about archetype but before that we talk a lot about myth and the potential harm of a society without the myth right so so what happened did any Can Can Ann or or Jose or you and I tell us a little about what happened did we really lose our mythology right we don't have uh access to Greek mythology or the Norse uh mythology for example but what about us we all are here in Western modern Western Society heavily replaced that uh really formal myth that we learned when we went to school to different type of source of that sacred story 101 psychology okay so and I um I wanted to have this idea of mid very clear in my mind so you were talking about the the you know the

e went to school to different type of source of that sacred story 101 psychology okay so and I um I wanted to have this idea of mid very clear in my mind so you were talking about the the you know the changing in times the story that we are connected so could we say that um you know the different periods that we pass in our history Empires that have risen and fall and um I don't know if the mythological beings or or history or stories that we have about the pantheon in Greece as well if all of that apply or not if I or if I'm completely going in a different direction can you just um ask me again please because I was paying attention to you and as as I told you my mind just went to an example of myths that Mars Marshall was it's something very um you know going back to the basics okay uh because we many of us here are are that are you know are really going to be following us and and are following our you know this uh Bob castle and like uh live uh we we are not that much familiar with uh the the terminologies the the death of uh you know this uh the psychology that that we all have so I was thinking uh from what I understood that you said uh the myth is going to be something that symbolic things that are going to be representative to us to our beliefs and so throughout history we had you know Wing piers and with their way of thinking and worshiping beings and that that was renewed even sometimes with this period of Crisis because of you know any kind of um uh or a hurricane or or volcanoes uh destroy them so I I wanted to know if this is what we are talking about is like you know the basis of our society or uh um and and also if uh we could say that the the mythological beings from ancient Greece and roma and Rome and the pantheon it's in in the same line or or if it doesn't have anything to do with what you're trying to do no no it's in other words we're confused we are confused so tell us give us some some um give us some um examples and uh because this is a lot of good stuff everyone so

o with what you're trying to do no no it's in other words we're confused we are confused so tell us give us some some um give us some um examples and uh because this is a lot of good stuff everyone so go go ahead take it away no it's it's good because if you are confused I imagine that everybody's going when I started studying this because I was a fraud and psychiatrist before I got confused myself I understand that young yes yes because young goes uh deeper in the unconscious Freud went uh to the personal unconscious the material there is the ego represses okay and is all in our impulses Drive is that the ego doesn't want to connect so it goes it represses use the egos the mechanisms of the fans and then it stays all this material stays in the personal unconscious but Yoon goes deeper that's why Joanna is using jungen terms okay and he gets to a point where he say well uh we all have our we are a Brotherhood of men and women you know human beings so all the experiences everything that we have learned all the ways to do something it's imprinted in our spirit this is Joanna actually because uh Jung says about talks about the archetypes he just says that analyzing dreams and in a vivid imaginations and even hallucinations of his patients because he was a psychiatrist uh he said he gets to a point of all these images and themes make a very Collective unconscious he gets to the bottom it's not the bottom because it's we don't know the limit but of a share um a share part of the unconscious that is our spiritual and psychic Heritage okay that we all share as uh as human beings and okay so when he gets to this point he found how did he got this idea because he found studying myths fairy tales dreams okay paying attention to this sacred stories like josado was saying I'm oh what about the Greeks and their mythologists everything in the Greeks times okay they didn't know anything about psychology actually but uh Socrates and Plato they knew about the soul they even talked about the Soul's

eeks and their mythologists everything in the Greeks times okay they didn't know anything about psychology actually but uh Socrates and Plato they knew about the soul they even talked about the Soul's journey and evolution and things like that so they knew that everything that we learned stays with us through all different journeys of the Soul so the idea of uh our luggage let's say the archetypes this ancient types that are deep within our Psych forming the collective unconscious that our it's our human potentials you know that it's going to express our spiritual and psychic quotation potential that is going to be expressing itself in a different way to each one of us okay and how did uh Jung got to this point observing myths from every different culture he was a very knowledgeable man and he traveled a lot he was he had a lot of culture he knew a lot of languages so he studied many many myths many fairy tales many dreams we calculate some of his very close analysts friends uh calculate that he is the scholar the person that analyzed the greatest amount of Dreams almost like 80 000 dreams during his lifetimes aiding so uh paying attention to all this imagery themes okay and the myths of different people he says now I'm going to give an example for instance the hero myth that I know that Marcia wants to talk about him some movies but for instance the hero myth is analogous to the development of Consciousness because their hero in every culture in different stories that people talk to each other in this in the East and the West okay the hero is that that character that sacrifices himself or herself for the collective sometimes it's not a celebrity okay celebrities are not Heroes because the hero is all about self-sacrifice sometimes they are not known throughout his uh his or her lifetime they they are starring you know are told to different peoples and then they get to be known later on in life after they adapt many times okay so we have uh different characters like

is or her lifetime they they are starring you know are told to different peoples and then they get to be known later on in life after they adapt many times okay so we have uh different characters like say uh but we could call them light teachers from the east from the West that give this example of self-sacrifice of a life lived giving example of those values that were we were saying that give us uh the possibility possibility of the growth growing you know and the growth of the Soul if we can say like so these are the heroes and they are part of a sacred our sacred stars because we say they they open the path for all of us so we are never alone there are a lot of people coming that have been around here before of us there will be a lot of people after us but how are we all connected through our Collective unconscious to this um I like very much when Jung says that the archetypes are you know like um Footprints of the Transcendence deep within our site love it love it love it this is beautiful beautiful so let's pause for just a second maybe and you want to comment on yeah all this amazing amazing uh discussions brought by anahi yeah a child's list in Chinese and thank you so much for bringing such clarification and we are thinking about like you know well I'm very much um a being of the 20th century although I'm here in the 21st century I was brought up and most of my life was in the 20th century and I reflect back and it was very materialistic uh century and I wonder if we had a certain disconnect from the sacred from the soul and we were very focused on the material because that seems to me like my youth and you know my friends and everything like that we were like throwing away all the old and old things all these are silly things from the people in the past we are modern people we thought at the time and we thought that you know these silly stories they have no value for us but then we ended up without meaning in our lives perhaps I don't say everybody but a lot of

rn people we thought at the time and we thought that you know these silly stories they have no value for us but then we ended up without meaning in our lives perhaps I don't say everybody but a lot of people perhaps in the in Western Society threw away the sacred stories and didn't realize the value and how they are part of us we can't throw them away but we've ignored them perhaps I thought that that was quite interesting because I never sort of thought about that before and uh it's like even dreams like people say oh dreams are sit we're saying oh just silly it means nothing or you're just processing your day but no and it's got all kinds of um imagery uh communication coming from your Deeper Self so I think this is something that I'm finding by studying Joanna giangelis is opening up to me this possibility of considering that I am much more than this my body and it is a slow Awakening for me but I was just reflecting about that awesome thank you thank you for the comment I I really appreciate that um and um when we when we talk about uh all that is brought to us and I really really appreciate that uh we're tenants and I think uh and it's more than your generation I think we're in the same generation by the way it's the West right so think about uh perhaps uh post World War II and that desire to live to live life in all that we we brought with us is kind of oh that's just something it's not tangible in in our material experience but I think and I agree with you a hundred percent that Joanna brings that to us and I invite everyone who's listening to us right now please please please take the time to get to know Joanna D'Angelo but anyways any additional comment and or jazada or anahi uh I wanted to um to tell you before because I know we are kind of in the end and there's so much talk about so we we should already invite people to the next yes uh but I I wanted to get this um this comment that Anne did that I think it's so important because it's a testimony of an erum

so much talk about so we we should already invite people to the next yes uh but I I wanted to get this um this comment that Anne did that I think it's so important because it's a testimony of an erum that I think we are in the 21st century um going to a The Next Step okay because the previous one that we were in and this also in the same you know I lived in the same period and I'm living here with you we are in a transitional phase right um and I I just wanted to to tell people and you all and it's so important what Annie said that for you in the midst uh are they are symbolic uh with their symbolic Construction would have the role of mediating the relationship between conscious life and the unconscious so you see how important it is and in this mediation a connection is established with the archaic memory of humanity so the archetypes that we were talking previously so in this sense for Meats to fulfill their purpose they have to be experienced lived right so when Anne says that her generation kind of lost contact because we are kind of children we are a result of a very destructive beginning in the past Century with the two World Wars okay just to talk about a very a storm a very ugly storm that you know involved everybody and I I just wrote quickly an example and I think it you know it fits very well with the ends the testimony that she gave to us of tokens Lord of the Rings that I know a lot of people that are listening to us have read have seen the movies right and a lot of different adaptations of Lord of the Rings so this epic for instance we in high fantasy or novel uh Tolkien wrote uh between 1937 and 1949 right in the second world war and he had participate in the first world war so can you imagine a person that has seen all of he was a scholar and an author right and had participated in something so a storm so ugly as the first world war being alive and conscious of the second World War what was going on so it's I think that we could um we could think of Lord of the Rings

icipated in something so a storm so ugly as the first world war being alive and conscious of the second World War what was going on so it's I think that we could um we could think of Lord of the Rings as a modern myth of our times right because uh he's using many symbols as for instance the rings of power right and to talk about the struggle of many peoples from a world called meter arrest that everybody knows I'm not giving spoilers at this point and to destroy the One Ring okay that could control and uh and you know have the power over all those peoples created by the lore the dark lord Sauron okay to rule the other ring so and peoples and in this novel there are many archetypal themes ancient things that uh come every time that we are developing Consciousness as human beings many of these things appear again as for instance a reversed Quest the struggle between good and evil death and immortality this is the Centro actually for token the center team a theme of Lord of the Rings fate and Free Will we are always struggling with this Concepts The Addictive danger of power isn't that modern unfortunately as well as elements like hope and Redemptive Redemptive suffering that we were talking about in the hero meet so I just wanted to give this example and say that and and remind Dan and everybody else when Joanna says that after the storm and and everybody else that are listening to us um something uh emerge okay there is something remember the Opposites that I was talking about so there's always something deep in our psych that it's the opposite of all this suffering that is going to emerge believe it believe it because it's the development of our consciousness and um then a new ideation as Joanna says in a creative myth appears filling that previous Gap and take us closer to that state that you were all talking about evangelity that we would love to achieve someday I think we can stay here um yes I I love that so thank you we had a wonderful wonderful time together this

o that state that you were all talking about evangelity that we would love to achieve someday I think we can stay here um yes I I love that so thank you we had a wonderful wonderful time together this past 45-ish minutes uh talking about uh myths and talked about this amazing work uh that Joanna the angels and many others uh brought to us to to humanity and with that I want to say thank you and I wanted to say to all of us we'll pick up in our next episode from the Hero Journey okay and I you know I want to talk about it so we'll we'll pick up from Joseph Gamble and uh perhaps some of the amazing work that he has brought to us and how potentially I can bet money that you have heard of uh Joseph Campbell and some of the things that he brought in the concept of the hero so thank you everyone and I'll see you next time foreign