Ep 22 - Psychology and Spirituality | Emotions and Sensations pt 1

foreign hi everyone welcome to the psychology and spirituality a bridge to a better life discussion I'm your host Marcia Trejo and with me are Dr anayi Fonseca and Sinclair and jusada coingode hi everyone thank you so much for being here and thank you who is joining us via the Internet just please note the psychology and spirituality program is brought to you by Ami Brazil United States spiritus Federation the TV monsando Camille and the international spiritus Council make sure you hit subscribe if you haven't already done so and if you'd like to check out other channels please check it out at www.spiritus.us take a moment to send your comments your questions any type of feedback we welcome all of them and we are in the process of maybe collecting some key questions to create this special episode to address them specifically and finally if you are interested in let me go ahead and put here in knowing more about the subject that we're going to be talking today we highly recommend that you follow these books written by Joanna DeAngelis uh in the first one it's in English uh life Challenge and solutions and the second one I don't believe it's been published in English yet I will not bore you with my Portuguese but here they are for your reference and um Wanted to to tell you that I am eager I am eager to learn more about this subject so I know you probably are as I as eager as I am so I'm gonna just ask Anna Yi if you could can you get us started talking about Sensations emotions feelings do we control them do they control us are they good are they bad tell us about it hello everyone so it's a pleasure to be here again and um that's a quite quite some questions so let's talk about all that I wanted to start with uh um one of uh call Gustav Young's quotes uh when he says a man who has not passed through The Inferno of his passions has never overcome them so I think that's a quite a provoking quote by Jung and that we should keep in mind while discussing Sensations emotions and feelings

passed through The Inferno of his passions has never overcome them so I think that's a quite a provoking quote by Jung and that we should keep in mind while discussing Sensations emotions and feelings so let's start uh with what Joanna tells us in those beautiful books that Marcia talked showed you off so she says that emotions and feelings present a rich and thought-provoking universe for everyone who wants to know and transform himself herself for the better it can be said that human beings not only have emotions but they can be possessed by them since they often Act thoughtlessly or are destabilized by these forces causing different reactions that they commonly regret concerning feelings the reasoning is the same considering that there are positive and negative feelings that take us over and sometimes dominate a large part of our lives even directing our thoughts sorry I was going to say can you talk a little bit about how does an emotion dominate our lives how can an emotion control someone's life specifically so exactly I was going to tell you all about that oh wonderful because the human being has great difficulty as Marsha is already realizing in you all and we because we are talking about ourselves right we are trying to look at ourselves our psyche and our emotions and feelings so we we all have difficulty in dealing with these forces perhaps precisely because of the impossibility of total control of them by intelligence and reasoning so Marsha I think in everybody I when I was reading John again and I was reflecting about all of this I remember a character that it's everybody especially in the U.S and also in Europe everybody we remember Mr Spock from Star Trek okay the book so we all love him dearly and I know we can connect remember people that the vocals were the the first extraterrestrial to get in contact with uh with us in the movie so they are of course fictional characters but we hope someday maybe who knows right but um the thing is that they are a species

e first extraterrestrial to get in contact with uh with us in the movie so they are of course fictional characters but we hope someday maybe who knows right but um the thing is that they are a species that um attempt to control by reasoning reasoning and rationalizing we could say okay uh the emotions they even have um a ritual and trackers are going to kill me if I say wrong but I think it's something like culinar or something like that that it's a ritual where they go through to try to purge emotions so what we we know is that they they have emotions but they spend a lot of time trying to control them okay and so to be in the in control of emotions maybe it's a dream of all of us right but the thing is that if we deny emotions okay for instance I feel something that I think it's quite negative Envy for instance or first of all I feel and we're going to be talking the program about some slight differences between emotion and feelings they they could be used at synonyms but you know but there are some different small difference but very important but let's say that uh something somebody made uh you know something that I didn't like against me and uh you know I got mad really mad and then I don't think it's quite okay to be mad at someone you know to say that I'm angry that I'm enraged and it's not nice to be like this it's not mature so what I can do and most people do actually even unconsciously is to try to deny what I'm feeling because the ego already has the our Consciousness already has made some kind of judgment and say this is no good it's going to affect the way that other people look at me they are not going to say oh you are okay they are going to say um you know this person is not okay because even our expression changes when we are feeling very angry at someone so what happens that the ego represses or denies and it follows the emotion falls to the unconscious in a very simple way we can say that but exactly because it goes to our unconscious mind we give more strength okay because then

represses or denies and it follows the emotion falls to the unconscious in a very simple way we can say that but exactly because it goes to our unconscious mind we give more strength okay because then we are not in control anymore so what happens is that uh in the first moment it will appear okay in a similar situation it will suddenly burst you know from down to up we could say to our Consciousness we without our control and then we look back when we calm down we think how could I have act like that it's not me it was somebody who took over but it is exactly us and it's just because we don't know ourselves that we have already judged that as very bad we have tried with the ego mechanism that we can talk in another program to repress to deny to put in the unconscious okay it's out of my mind I think it's out of my mind but our mind our minds are made of the conscious stuff and the unconscious okay so actually it's there and it gets much more energy because it's the unconscious we could say in a very simple way so what happens is that okay I'm going to live in my life oh I feel bad I feel okay sorry okay because now I'm not I'm not feeling not judging in myself I I have control I got control over my emotions and exactly the opposite they are there the emotion is there and I lost control because now my conscience is not dealing with the emotion anymore so let's go back to Mr Spock so in the remake of Skype track with the young guys I don't know if you remembered some years ago they were great by the way you know the movie so remember um well I don't want to give spoilers but you know everybody so so what happens is that spark is a child of Two Worlds I think this is great because the mother is from Earth and the father is a vocal so he's always in Conflict should he try to purge his emotions you know or and go through all the way through the ritual the calling are or whatever it's called or should uh you know him just accept that he has emotions like we do on Earth

y to purge his emotions you know or and go through all the way through the ritual the calling are or whatever it's called or should uh you know him just accept that he has emotions like we do on Earth and try to made a balance of everything that and accept who he is so this is I like very much the character because uh you know it's a conflict that we all have in our evolution sorry but could you say that he's actually epitomizes exactly what Jung was saying you he cannot get better until he finds the conflict within himself therefore Mr Spock is repressing culturally his his uh background pushes him to repress but his conflict about repressing and feeling emotions is actually what makes him better I like very much Martin I like very much exactly because you know I remember a scene okay spoiler alert please uh in this movie with the young guys you know they are great and um when the his Planet woke explodes or something you know in a black in a black hole the bad guy made all of this and Spock loses the mother okay in the transport they weren't able and in the first imagine you were holding your mother's hand and suddenly she's not there anymore okay so uh it's a very important part and you know very deep you can see the suffering the actor is great by the way and you can see the suffering in his face so and the astonished you know he's you know the impact is huge but he goes on as like if because he's now the uh he is the person responsible Commander or whatever of the ship and the thing is that the captain and the thing is that he tries to go Zone as if nothing had happened he tries to be a good Vulcan let's say yeah right and what happens a lot of things goes on but in the in the end the old Spark by the way Leonard Nimoy wherever you are we love you thank you so much so much for Mr Slack live long and prosper and the thing is that um okay the old spark tells a Kirk spoil I learned again that he should try to emotionally compromise the young Spock so that's everything can go back to the

ive long and prosper and the thing is that um okay the old spark tells a Kirk spoil I learned again that he should try to emotionally compromise the young Spock so that's everything can go back to the timeline that they need that Kurt be the captain and Spark be the second in command whatever and the friendship can goes on because this the friendship will Define them so what happens is that Kirk really does that because the old spot said this is very very important to be done and he almost gets killed because Vulcans are much stronger than humans right and then Spock at that moment when the father says Spock then Spock suddenly realize okay that he was totally possessed by the emotion by The Rage he was feeling that was projected onto a Kirk so this is one of the mechanisms of the fence that we do the replacement we okay we it's not there in that person in that situation that I'm mad at but then I repressed so much in the night so much then in the first occasion I will similar I will project uh onto another person in that situation and then he says to the medical person can't remember the name now but trackers please forgive me it's a great character the doctor and oh Bones the card calls him Bones so he it tells bones to uh write down that he's stepping down from you know from being the captain because he is emotionally compromised at that moment he says that I'm emotionally compromised so in the moment that you say Martian and everybody that you recognize the emotion and the emotion can be in your conscious mind then you are in control isn't that a paradox yes but it's very important that I can acknowledge my own emotions because then I am in control then I'm working emotionally immensely and I'm accepting everything that I am if I don't accept my emotions it will be very hard for me to deal with them I don't know if I I made it a little bit clearer this is perfect but I wanted to maybe pause here to ask josada and Anne and you and I need to talk a little bit about uh the whole if there is a

h them I don't know if I I made it a little bit clearer this is perfect but I wanted to maybe pause here to ask josada and Anne and you and I need to talk a little bit about uh the whole if there is a Continuum and I don't know if there is but the the difference in the Continuum between sensation emotions feeling is this a good time for us maybe spend a minute or what are your examples perhaps so that it contextualizes this discussion to the public what is an example of a sensation was example of emotion what is an example of a Feeling okay sorry can I just jump in before that sorry sure sure it's just because I think Anais had such a important things and it had me thinking because I'm just thinking at least about my own life and perhaps many people are like me when you're being when I was a child when I was being brought up by my parents and you had strong emotions you were told you can't have this you can't be angry you can't cry you can't kick off you must be a good person you must be a good girl you know kind of repress the teaching you to repress your emotions from childhood that's my generation we were brought up like that to be good good uh kids you had to control and and you almost like ignore and put behind you and swallow your emotions even I remember sometimes the swallowing of the crying and the anger it hurt your throat if that feeling of having to to swallow it so we are brought up like that and now you're suggesting actually what it's not the The Way Forward perhaps The Way Forward is to recognize our emotions but what do we do with them when we recognize them we can't all go around behaving completely emotional because the world will look function so I was just thinking that because what do we put in place of it you see what I mean because if this is the way we've been brought up and say yeah okay I'm trying to acknowledge okay I'm in the traffic the person cut in front of me yeah I'm angry okay I'm okay I'm okay I'm okay you know this it's all gone gone now it's not

rought up and say yeah okay I'm trying to acknowledge okay I'm in the traffic the person cut in front of me yeah I'm angry okay I'm okay I'm okay I'm okay you know this it's all gone gone now it's not gone because I'm still angry because that person cut ahead of me and made me break suddenly or whatever simple uh okay occasion in life but I'm just thinking it's like we need new tools new ways of of acknowledging our emotions and what to do with them to not to be angry with them not to think they're bad things things of the devil or the bad side I don't know if you have anything that you could help us suggest I just wanted to say something because I think it goes along the line of what Ayan is is talking about and then and now you can bring the conclusions and since we are being personal um one crazy experience that I had with uh emotion and maybe I'm still dealing with that is um um some years ago I I had breast cancer and I I went through all the surgeries Etc and um and my mother died of breast cancer as a result of years later and um I would be going to the the oncologist the hospital all the time and then you see all those patients that um you know are are going through cancer very skinny very you know um pale all of that and during that time I went to the opposite way I started putting on weight and um it came to a point that of course I was overweight but I I I I I couldn't do anything about it and um finally I came to the realization that um that was a result of you know the fear and the mathematics that I was doing was the following if I lose weight if I'm skinny it's because I'm going to die it's because my cancer is bad and it took me I mean so many years to deal with that and to finally start losing weight and um and the crazy thing is I knew it but I I couldn't control it it was Stronger than Me In terms of you know I I know I I went to talk even to the the the the psychiatrist and psychologist at the the cancer hospital and I mean I told her I know what is going on but how

s Stronger than Me In terms of you know I I know I I went to talk even to the the the the psychiatrist and psychologist at the the cancer hospital and I mean I told her I know what is going on but how can I you know hold this this now so I I think it is uh in the lines of of what Anne is talking about what's talking about as well in terms of emotions and they're there the both examples are are very difficult in your case and um but are very important because the everybody you know a lot of people go through the same experiences that you you have both have um and for instance josana we could say that in that moment you and everybody else that have to face uh you know cancer or a disease that are diseases that are life-threatening right um have to deal with uh fear fear of dying even if we already know for instance as a spirit is that Consciousness go on that we leave you know beyond the the death of the body but it's not the death of the spirit that if the spirit goes on but the ego and other parts of ourselves are that young called complexes okay uh like small personalities the child that or the Adolescent or the young woman that you were when your mother died for instance and you uh you had to help her through all the her process so the memory of the feelings that you had on those moments are imprinted in your brain and in your mind so even if you now are an adult and have another knowledge and understanding of life and you know you don't have to be afraid but um of course you are a human being and you are here with an ego and with an experience of life and with complexes together okay and that have memories they are and they have memories they have purpose they have experiences related to some emotions so what you were feeling uh was of course that made you gain weight and things like that of course you have told out yourself that uh was fear of you know being as uh watching those people losing weight and maybe uh being near death with that uh with that struggle with cancer

gs like that of course you have told out yourself that uh was fear of you know being as uh watching those people losing weight and maybe uh being near death with that uh with that struggle with cancer but to acknowledge fear and it it has to be in your own time it's not the time of the watch it's not the time of all but now okay I have I have to you know overcome this because I know I'm an adult and I'm a spiritist but you are not dealing with your conscious mind in the in the in this moment you are dealing with memories and parts of your self there are in the unconscious so what what we say is that we have to be strong to go through the suffering and be able to acknowledge the the feeling the emotion okay and just uh be able to hold the emotion and to remember not being afraid of a member to because then you're going to make connections oh when okay I'm an adult I have all this um this new Concepts that are not only Concepts I leave what I believe I have my beliefs I have my spirituality so this should make okay for me to go through a difficult period in life and Maybe not maybe you are going to feel different emotions that are not exactly from this moment in time but they are in the unconscious so we have to hold them you know like a mother holds the baby you can be with me because you are part of my experience and you are precious it's okay it's all part of myself and why are all these emotions precious because they teach us things like a example that Anne told us in the traffic why do sometimes people uh just lose it totally okay they get mad they go out of the car they go in a struggle if they don't do worse things right because they think that it's uh it's not okay for me to be angry or to enrage myself with someone but just remember if I if I felt I felt it's part of me so if I say it's okay then my memory of those moments for instance in the traffic um it was wrong what somebody did to me because almost you know I got in an accident the person or maybe I was not

me so if I say it's okay then my memory of those moments for instance in the traffic um it was wrong what somebody did to me because almost you know I got in an accident the person or maybe I was not paying attention talking the mobile or whatever texting don't do that people right and then okay I there was something that I I can't be mad at the other driver but the mistake was mine so many times this happens so if I just hold okay I'm angry and I got mad and I want to scream if you want to scream scream with the windows and clothes okay but then there will be a memory of what happened because the memories in our brain they are much related to the emotions in the moment and if I can hold everything in that precise moment probably I'm not going to make a lot of sense it's not going to make a lot of sense to me but later on because I haven't repressed and I say okay I didn't like myself okay in those moments but the feeling the emotion is there so it's there but then I can start relating and working the with the emotions and um not letting uh some other complex in my unconscious take over so then I am in control and then the memory okay I have to learn then we learn people because then I learned oh I shouldn't text while I'm driving I made a mirror and or the other driver was also doing whatever so that was bad then I don't do it again you see how important it is and for instance example if it's always painful to connect to Memories when we lose someone okay memories of loss memories of some watching somebody that we love um you know hurting or having to face a difficult treatment for instance but um this moment this suffering that we have been going through uh if we can just realize okay my fear is to be exactly like that then you are going to unfold a lot of other feelings that were there in the experience and that you repressed then you discover a lot of meaning and purpose to that moment to those moments and then suddenly you are not afraid anymore and then suddenly okay you are

here in the experience and that you repressed then you discover a lot of meaning and purpose to that moment to those moments and then suddenly you are not afraid anymore and then suddenly okay you are going to lose weight naturally don't have to struggle because you are not afraid anymore for instance in your example but I I think it's great that you had help psychological health because sometimes people say no I have to be strong and I will understand what's going on with me and if it is in the unconscious or maybe and very well you know hidden maybe sometimes we need help to go through and you know something that it's in the unconscious I don't know what you think about that's a little okay with this comments yes yes and and I even think um and I when we when we're talking about those uh projections of the fears Etc and the complexes that it's all there and and that's why they're not simple they're complex I'm just making a joke here but but it's it's it's a lot to to deal with uh but one of the things that came to my mind and I when in in discussing the example which is a master example and the you know being angry being angry with somebody cutting you off when while you're driving and the beauty of it is that we human beings as social gregarious animals we learn exactly when we're inserted into a collective therefore feeling anger and we can talk about why am I angry because I almost had an accident or is it because I want to be the first to to arrive or whatever is it my ego or is it my my sense of preservation right so I think it's really interesting to start to check in the mechanism in my in my point of view and you may want to confirm or or completely say no Mercia you're wrong is that self-check it's the self-discovery it's the the process of analyzing and as we today we um we remember about a year ago when in the Oscars I don't know if you remember where Will Smith comes in and just sleps uh Chris Rock the the comedian in his face and boy did that just kept going on and on and on

r about a year ago when in the Oscars I don't know if you remember where Will Smith comes in and just sleps uh Chris Rock the the comedian in his face and boy did that just kept going on and on and on and uh and we could not not talk about the event and I think that itself was the basis of how do I feel about being attacked what is the whole sense of dignity or Pride right etcet so I think those moments the collective moments beat on TV or be it in traffic with your windows rolled up so you can scream those are great opportunity for us to face those emotions and try to understand rationally I'm going to Mr Spock originally but not repressing right but rationalize why am I going through this and let's let's let's let's go on with the feelings because they're triggered by something right yeah I think the uh those that Oscar ceremony was uh in the middle of the pandemic or something I think it was about uh yes about yeah yeah so I think it's quite nice that you remember that because um that's a very good example of the collective okay being angry at the situation being suffering the situation with fears you know and individually and collectively we were like that so if there is something that triggers uh um the you know the anger and the fear then we are going to project in the situation okay that it was bad of course everybody knew it was very unpolite and and it's we shouldn't you know laugh at things that are people suffering but it's a mechanism of Defense The Laughing okay um that people do because of otherwise we would all be crying and I want to but actually we should be crying sometimes and not being um ashamed of crying it's much it would be much more mature but then I want to just hold this thought to read to you some beautiful thoughts that Jason and Marlo in reflecting the soul that it's not translated yet and translated to you um made about you know the feelings and emotions when they say in the chapter it's emotions and feelings that color Our Lives but we need to know how to choose the

translated yet and translated to you um made about you know the feelings and emotions when they say in the chapter it's emotions and feelings that color Our Lives but we need to know how to choose the colors you think this answer is quite nicely correct well they are like forces that can either lead us to our personal health or to the heaven of our best accomplishments okay so it depends on how we deal with our emotions and feelings it's not that they are if they are positive or negative the the judge will have to be ourselves okay and the way that we use them the knowledge that they bring the learning as Marsha said that they bring us okay so um we they keep saying that currently the emotional emotional Dimension has become for many a synonym of weakness instability or imbalance exactly your example Martian I remember the Oscar ceremony and we tend to avoid talking studying or discussing what we can't handle okay but the question arises how is it possible to have control or understand something that it's unknown that is not reflected upon with which there is no contact would it be a vicious cycle in which we try to cancel something we have no control over and precisely in this attempt to cancel we are taking over by it so I think these questions that they make in the chapter is exactly what we are talking about if we try to cancel for instance this modism or whatever in the social media to canceling somebody because this and that it's actually very silly and sorry people and childish okay some people will get mad at me but from the psychological point of view um exactly because Marshall is saying we are collective beings we learn together so if I don't like something that the other person is saying uh if I do we have those monkeys right if people help me that I don't I'm not listening I'm not seeing anything I won't talk you are canceled okay so this is like the child we do with a baby oh who is there when we you do like that with the who is there oh hello it's me

I'm not listening I'm not seeing anything I won't talk you are canceled okay so this is like the child we do with a baby oh who is there when we you do like that with the who is there oh hello it's me so we cannot cancel something okay because we are we are sooner or later we are going to have to deal with okay the and if this is a kind of a rule talking about the unconscious and the psychological way that we are and we function that if something bothers me a lot okay a lot it's not me that that is saying this is a you know every psychologist and Psychiatry knows that and I'm sorry okay for bringing this but I think it's very important that people know about that we are talking from the psychological point of view if something bothers me a lot I mean a lot okay the answer to this anger or to this rage or whatever you want to call it it's not in the other person or in the situation so you could try to cancel but uh okay I'm not going to bother with that but then exactly in this moment you have put the thing that it's bothering you and it's trying to surface to the Consciousness okay and it was triggered by whatever the people the people or the person that in the situation uh brought to you it was triggered and it's okay it was bad uh you know that the person said this or that but the reaction the emotional reaction it was mine I was feeling it I could have you know I don't care whatever I'm not going to listen to this person anymore okay but if I feel very strongly and I get mad and I get to do something and I go to the social media and say this and that and I will cancel and blah blah blah and now I I get into fights and things like like that uh I'm not doing exactly what we are trying to say now that I should hold forget about the person the situation oops I have a very strong emotion so I have to hold like a baby it's mine because I'm feeling my heart my body my mind okay all these systems are feeling something uh so I have to pay attention to what I'm feeling and to see why this um why

ave to hold like a baby it's mine because I'm feeling my heart my body my mind okay all these systems are feeling something uh so I have to pay attention to what I'm feeling and to see why this um why did this situation this person bother me so much okay and then the answer is not going to be in the person the answer is going to be inside myself wow then I have learned something about myself isn't that great maybe if it's something that I don't like very much but don't it doesn't matter because now I'm in control now I'm in control if I don't like I'm going to work on that I'm so I want this color in my painting like the author said in this chapter no I don't like this color so I'm going to try to put it down I don't like the red red red of passion so I'm going to put some white and I'm going to make a little pink or whatever so I'm slowing down and I'm in control I think this uh it's very good that you you know all these examples that you're uh are bringing because it's very useful and we have to pay attention we have a beautiful opportunity to know better like we are doing with the podcasts but we have to choose the colors so if I use the media the internet the social media you know to get a little more neurotic okay I'm coloring with my own colors nobody can be playing but if I'm using all this weight like uh like and we are talking previously to the two of the the program the recording of just getting closer knowing that we are human beings that our emotions doesn't matter if we have a notion apart we can feel each other's emotions and we can help each other wow then we are going to evolve very quickly on positive all right so let's go ahead and maybe wrap it all up because we talked here about emotions and feelings and you started with call Gustav young telling us you have to go through it right he even uses the word Inferno the the hell of that emotions that you don't like about yourself or you that you're feeling by doing it by acknowledging then you start to conquer it which is a

it right he even uses the word Inferno the the hell of that emotions that you don't like about yourself or you that you're feeling by doing it by acknowledging then you start to conquer it which is a very interesting aspect we talked about Dr Spock Mr Spock I'm sorry Mr Spock right or is it Dr spark Dr Bones Bones is the doctor yes yes it's been too long since I've seen I gotta go back to Star Trek but uh Mr Spock with his Duality which is a beautiful character if you think from a psychological perspective right The Duality between I need to be very rational and and and that's my strength but then he understands that the conflict with emotion is what really got him to be very strong and then we talked about uh uh very personal examples right and of you and yuzada on on how do emotions really have a physical impact known or not known you you actually can taste swallowing the anger or or the fear or not control your body in a reaction to to a memory uh known or not known right so I think those are really good insightful uh comments I invite all of you uh who is watching us today to come next week because we have a continuation of this topic so with that I want to say thank you thank you for being with us send us your questions and we look forward to continue this discussion bye bye see you all in the next program foreign