Ep 25 - Psychology and Spirituality | The Ego pt 2

foreign welcome back to the psychology and spirituality a bridge to a better life discussion with Dr anahi Who joins me today to to talk a little bit more about uh The elusive ego what is it why should we even talk about it Dr anahi but I wanted to to uh tell everyone here who doesn't know this program is brought to you by Sev organizations the United States spiritus Federation the TV my apologies and the international spiritus Council and if you haven't done so already please do hit subscribe so you can get uh notifications of our programs and if you'd like to check other channels please check us out at spiritus.us finally if you have any any questions or comments please do send us those comments feedback and you can use the chat window because we would love to address them and if we don't have time today we will address them in a future episode um the the subject today is mostly coming from of course the conscious being by Joanna DeAngelis and uh the book reflecting the soul that book is in the process being published in English so I love to to tell you when it's it's here for us to to buy so you could read it but I wanted to say how you doing fine thank you very much Happy here with you all awesome awesome so Anna is going to be here talking to you about the ego the second part of our conversation but I wanted to bring um a quote that uh Anna you mentioned last week right so she said this is from Joanna DeAngelis and roughly uh Joanna states that let me let me say this slowly because it's it's packed full of content here Joanna told us the conquest of Consciousness is a very painful birth of the unconscious which continues to hold a significant part of the psychic contents that the ego needs and must assimilate in that moment when it becomes aware of the pretentious repository and begins to express itself through it Consciousness manifests itself so we it's almost like we have a a sci-fi movie here we talk about uh overcoming in achievement and we talk about Consciousness we talk about pain

ress itself through it Consciousness manifests itself so we it's almost like we have a a sci-fi movie here we talk about uh overcoming in achievement and we talk about Consciousness we talk about pain we talked about uh unconscious versus conscious and in the middle of it we talk about our topic or discussion the ego so tell me or tell us uh what happens when the ego faces that content of the unconscious can we talk about it yes we must talk about it actually we all need to talk about it but before that I just wanted to bring I was listening to Mars and remind me of a sentence of by Joseph Campbell who we all know that he was a very good friend of George Lucas from Star Wars and the last episode we Martha and I were talking about the we also talked about the hero myth when we say the or the myth of the hero and it has a lot of to do with this development of Consciousness that Joanna is saying this sentence that Marsa brought to us the painful birth of the ego and the need that the ego has to assimilate to get in contact with this uh contents in the unconscious because the ego is like this it's the center of Consciousness okay and so it actually is classifying or we could say um is actually is responsible for what comes in our Consciousness and also for uh what it's goes down to the unconscious as if we could say so when the ego is afraid of something or cannot deal with something it doesn't allow this something to get uh in Consciousness okay and what's going to happen is that it will use the mechanisms of the fence that Freud and Anna Freud uh were the the ones that uh actually classify the the mechanisms of the fence the ego's mechanisms of Defense and um to defend itself actually and to put this contents what is threatening it the ego to go back or to really put it uh in the unconscious but I like very much this Joseph Campbell sentence when he says how to get rid of the ego as a dictator and turn it into a messenger a servant and a patroller to serve us that's the

in the unconscious but I like very much this Joseph Campbell sentence when he says how to get rid of the ego as a dictator and turn it into a messenger a servant and a patroller to serve us that's the trick I like to think that sums it all up right if we if we remember nothing but this sentence by Joseph Campbell we are good to go it's it's re the reversal of roles between a dictator or it it and everything else is under its its own uh guidelines I wanted to to maybe ask for just a second here um and I could you perhaps correct me because this is how I see um where uh if you if you think in terms of this enormous triangle that is the iceberg perhaps right and and here right at the tip there is the the line of the ocean where this enormous Iceberg lies and when we talk about the center of the conscious is really the middle of that what is seen above the con the the ocean and everything else is your unconscious which means we really know very little about ourselves is this a correct representation yes it is I like very much this image of course it is a little bit different from from Freudian point of view and from jungen point of view but the iceberg uh for Freud for instance um the the what is above the surface in the iceberg would be the consciousness and the ego would be the center of it like Marsha was saying you know the very center of the but so what would be under the the ocean that it's much bigger of course then it would be the unconscious for fright and we could say the surface of the the ocean would be the repression barrier okay so forthroid everything that it's under uh this surface um so this barrier would be the unconscious and of course it's not so different because you agree with that in the sense of the personal existing a personal unconscious but for Jung there's also um what we know the collective unconscious uh but it's for another episode right so I think it's uh very important why would the ego uh one why would it want to be a dictator uh well you talked in the last episode

ow the collective unconscious uh but it's for another episode right so I think it's uh very important why would the ego uh one why would it want to be a dictator uh well you talked in the last episode about the inflation of the ego right actually Marshall and everyone when we are we say oh you are being very narcissistic but uh this narcissism we can think as a defense mechanism also it's like the person like protects itself from the outside of course from the inner contents that are pressing also but especially it's um you know when I'm if I could um just hold myself and forget everything that you know I have to exchange Impressions and I have to be open to other people's um opinions and emotions so when the person is hurt for instance we were talking about traumas in childhood right um especially in childhood because it's when the ego is being you know organized by the personality or or actually developing the personality sorry so what happens is that um if hassle if the ego that it's so frail has uh you know a lot of traumas and doesn't know how to deal and it is really threat and of its own existence then it's going to protect because we were talking about in the last episode that the narcissism in small children it's uh totally normal because it's a way that the ego is protecting itself we could say that but if we go on through life developing so we forgot if we get stuck in in childhood in the psychological sense and we cannot develop you know empathy and other in a sense of the other that it's being different from myself it could be it could be certain drug could you call it emotional intelligence or or this is completely outside because when we talked about empathy I I immediately think about emotional in intelligence right not rational intelligence but when we we go into the territory of emotions it's very dense right and and for us to learn to uh intelligently navigate we need to be able to to go through that painful birth that uh perhaps uh Joanna was talking about one of the things that

ons it's very dense right and and for us to learn to uh intelligently navigate we need to be able to to go through that painful birth that uh perhaps uh Joanna was talking about one of the things that I I wanted to bring here perhaps and I don't want to distract you but just to to let you know what I'm thinking is uh Joanna just um published a book uh uh just published uh maybe six months ago uh empty lives right uh where somehow if you read it and and this is really important because you're talking about narcissism as a mechanism that is perfectly healthy for a young child that is still creating developing the ego right as a structural need for for us to to survive but uh in that book Empty lives uh if you're not aware you may end up quote unquote demonizing uh social media because social media leads to exactly what you're saying that uh a creation of a world that is very curated that is very well rehearsed it's very artificial in in plastic so when I and I I oh here's my phone so when I look at here and I you know put uh take a photo and oh no my hair is out of place face delete let me try again until it's curated it is so perfect that I put out there but we know that it's not life that uh that sense of rehearsal life is not life is after you deleted a hundred poses right but I I think it's lovely what you're talking about this this need uh to to see narcissism as one in many other uh defense mechanisms of the ego yeah because then uh the thing is that uh it's totally normal in childhood it's part of actually the psychic life and childhood but um if you have get stuck there okay because of a trauma serious trauma then you are going that your inner child that will always be with you because our inner child are always with us right um it will like a beam a complex an emotional part dissociated in a sense that it's not it has not been assimilated yet as Joanna was telling us right yeah that ego must assimilate must hold must work with this content must reflect upon them must cure in a

ciated in a sense that it's not it has not been assimilated yet as Joanna was telling us right yeah that ego must assimilate must hold must work with this content must reflect upon them must cure in a sense to understand the promise of the inner child and liberate them okay really understand the different parts of what happened and and so that's the self-discovery process that Joanna says it's an inner Journal Journey so what happens is that if you get stuck and you feel you know the inner child is very active and the social media unfortunately are doing that to a lot of people you get stuck I'm sorry if somebody gets upset but it's the truth from the psychological point of view that if um it doesn't matter okay if you are taking a selfie you know to send someone to say oh I'm here and everything is fine and this and that it's something but if I spend um I'm for instance I'm traveling just a small episode I was some years ago before the pandemic I was in Italy and Pompeii yeah and beautiful the broken and all this stuff so I was going up and there were uh you know they were early adult adults okay like in the end of teenage years in early and they were okay not looking at nature not you know talking about the Ancient Rome or whatever or what happened here the history and all this stuff they were very worried they they had us the the mobiles and like Marsa said taking pictures the whole time of themselves together or alone and so they were not connecting to the Here and Now and even to put this uh pictures in the social media whatever you know the whatever media you have uh it's it won't say anything of what you thought about all the history that you were there um supposedly because otherwise you could be at home and just put a picture in the back and whatever okay if you want but if I am in some place and I of course I want to you know see the nature see the people connect to the place have fun with my friends that are there with me otherwise it's pointless so it is a narcissistic

am in some place and I of course I want to you know see the nature see the people connect to the place have fun with my friends that are there with me otherwise it's pointless so it is a narcissistic situation that nowadays our society it's and unfortunately the immediate social medias are instigated in the especially the children and the teenager and then the inner child that feels alone as Jonah said the life is empty because to to give meaning to life we need ourselves we need a strong and mature ego that can reflect and connect to the reality the inner and the outer reality okay even to change to reflect upon you know Philosophy for God's sake right yeah yeah psychology and the all the Arts so we say that we are in a very in this moment in a in a very narcissistic society when not everybody not all the situations but when we get lost in all this um you know now I remember that a great movie Lost in Translation yes yes Sophia Coppola was the director it's beautiful uh it's like like we are Lost in Translation okay I love it I love it we are we losers ourselves in in between the world of being and seen and and not unable to do I cognitively do I understand what's going on right love it love it what a great metaphor yeah and the ego is the center of Consciousness so the ego is selecting and it's uh approving or not uh what's going to remain in conscious and even what we are going to register so the narcissistic position I don't register uh actually really psychologically and emotionally speaking that's why you remembered uh emotional intelligence it's it's impaired in this kind of situation our emotion and and doesn't develop well okay our emotional intelligence and let's remember that there is a spiritual intelligence also so but even the in the emotional part it's going to be impaired our intelligent Italian emotional intelligence because I'm not relating uh you know to the contents uh and I'm not even paying attention to my inner let's say oh um it's hot here uh but how

e impaired our intelligent Italian emotional intelligence because I'm not relating uh you know to the contents uh and I'm not even paying attention to my inner let's say oh um it's hot here uh but how the Romans would deal with that 2 000 years ago can you imagine the vocal exploding how people would feel no because I'm worried with my hair if it looks like this and that you know yes it's so awkward to think of this point so let's uh in the reflecting the soul the book that you um that we use as reference the authors when they are talking about um about Joanna's contents okay they they say something like this the Imperials they are talking about um Joanna so this is Joanna's quote the imperious need for survival of the ego the fear of failing of not getting it right of not being considered the greatest or the best make people create an impeding barrier to the development of the potentialities that like latent in human beings can you imagine so all the potentialities that are there in our unconscious not only the contents that we don't we wouldn't like to pay attention that we are thinking or feeling okay the instincts and all of that these two presses you know from down we could say the unconscious up to our Consciousness because actually maturity means that we can live with ourselves ourselves we can accept who we are and not being proud in a child this sense we were we were talking about the hero right but to having an ego that can be grateful for all the experiences the Bad and the good experiences that uh belonged to me and that actually make whom I am and I think at that point you you achieve peace and a sense of uh I guess the word that comes to our mind is fulfillment of of being whole again when we see the the the the the ego and the self right the the inner and the outer the all the dualities that we face with ourselves I expected let's pretend I expect it to be X and I my life Journey led me to why and it's okay right it's okay to to to deviate I don't have to to create or

l the dualities that we face with ourselves I expected let's pretend I expect it to be X and I my life Journey led me to why and it's okay right it's okay to to to deviate I don't have to to create or repress what I have become perhaps exactly because uh don't we all actually want inner peace as martial was saying yeah but how can we achieve inner peace if we accept and we don't have to who we are and we don't have to hide ourselves anymore and we are not afraid of ourselves anymore because if we are afraid of ourselves we are going to project that's one of uh other mechanisms of defense that we are going to be talking about soon so we are going to use some mechanism of Defense so that the ego gets rid of the this content of this perception that for instance that I'm afraid of of myself of some content that I uh find that is threatening my image or the image that I would like to you know to sell to the world so then the ego will do uh everything it can to just put this content back to the unconscious but see what Joanna says that faced with um a socially constructed ideal Martian that you said about the social medias and this you know nowadays it looks like a lot of people are not reflecting about that many people are in the same room uh you know seeing stuff in their mobiles in the social media and not talking to you know to family to friends sometimes they are in restaurants looking in the mobiles and not talking to we are so rich of contents of reflections of ways of diff um seeing life isn't that great if we can exchange all these ideas it's much better than opening Windows things or just doing a zoom thing in the in a social media to see uh what celebrities said these are that that doesn't mean anything because it doesn't relate to my life so Joanna says faced with a socially constructed ideal in some life situations man is moved by the immature will to change something in himself or herself yeah whether it be a desire a thought an emotion an attitude or feeling that

ially constructed ideal in some life situations man is moved by the immature will to change something in himself or herself yeah whether it be a desire a thought an emotion an attitude or feeling that reflects reflects in adequacy this conflict between what is experience and what is idealized was wisely identified by Freud and directed him towards understanding the functioning of the personal unconscious so it's very beautiful right where where she in in one statement brings it all together she she brings Freud in Psychology she brings Jung in Psychology she brings spirituality but most importantly she understands the the problem that we're talking today about our life ourselves our youth and in this um uh exaggerated need to to to narcissistic uh belong in the society right the Society of uh influencers in in in beautiful and powerful and whatever is that that the the demands of the external World puts us as the idea of success that idealized a view of where we should be versus the authentic self beautiful exactly exactly and she says that um there is if we connect to the idea of the unconscious of course because what it's not in Consciousness is unconscious to us so if if it is unconscious and the ego uh is trying to avoid desperately and losing a lot of energy because this is psychic energy to do all of this stuff she says that there is no way to eliminate an imperfection as an act of suppression you cannot say this doesn't exist I'm going to get rid of that that it's impossible that's why and then we we get neurotic if we try to do that because it's part of us it doesn't matter what it is it's part of us so the most that we can achieve is to withdraw it from conscious mind but it's going to be there with a lot of energy connected to this contents okay so and I we have to understand also that's young ways of thinking and also Joanna when she talks all the time about the evolutionary process throughout all her works and writings and Jung says that the soul the psyche

to understand also that's young ways of thinking and also Joanna when she talks all the time about the evolutionary process throughout all her works and writings and Jung says that the soul the psyche is teleological so it's going somewhere okay we say that young um is very positive because he is the first I think to talk in an academic way about the psyche the soul and its development it's Evolution it's going somewhere it's evolving and so we can think that the unconscious itself moves in order to be made known okay as a nimples of awareness necessary for human evolution okay so we we should not we must not run for ourselves because we are uh remember Joseph Campbell we need the ego as a messenger as a patroller as a server because we need to evolve we are not evolving taking self to put in the social media yeah that would would not work uh we can okay say try it's a very um very uh just how could I say uh just quick way of feeling okay as a very small way of feeling okay for some minutes sometimes not even minutes yeah yeah the next moment I'm thinking oh like Martha said but my head uh my hair was not okay and I have already put the the picture or I see it again and I oh that's so awful I don't look what my friends are going to say and this and that but but I think there's a head of dopamine right every time you pretend pretend because it's very superficial way of connecting every time somebody likes you every time you you you approve of yourself as you show up in in an image or in a video curated or not then you you get that hit of dopamine and uh and I think that is the the cycle uh that can lead to to really an addictive behavior toward my mobile device I I want in in leading this you know feeding into the narcissistic uh culture that the Western Society has become part of yes exactly I agree with you and um so what we we should do right is not fall in this trap yeah right yeah because uh uh I think Martha when uh listening to you that we we can easily get addict you know yeah

ctly I agree with you and um so what we we should do right is not fall in this trap yeah right yeah because uh uh I think Martha when uh listening to you that we we can easily get addict you know yeah about that yeah to get stuck in this need yeah and we have the hormones thereiness and so I'm feeling so because I had a lot of likes or something like that but this will pass because this is a physiology of the body yeah so to feel okay with myself I don't need I I really don't need uh you know to have all this going on all the time because of the inner peace that you send um feel in the hormones it's okay especially when you are young you want to feel the rush adrenaline adrenaline rush and things like that but uh this will go away and then we'll have you'll have a feeling of emptiness as Joanna says right so to really have uh you know happiness we have to feel good with ourselves uh it's not that we don't need the others we need each others right with each other but uh we need to feel uh good first with ourselves the other Within Myself oh that's beautiful that's beautifully said yes considers an other but it's really not it's part of me so fraud teaches that there are two ways for the ego to try to defend itself from what does not need its ideal repression and resistance resistance is more when you are under analysis so we don't need to talk too much about that but repression consists of the movement of withdrawing something from Consciousness towards the unconscious as if seeking an introversion right so taking something from consciousness so repressing the content and uh sending it back to the unconscious right and and this and I this is a a defense mechanism that let's say if I'm doing that I'm not even aware that I'm doing that right I'm I'm repressing either trauma or something that I am and it it is part of who I am integral part of who I am but I my ego in me dislikes it does not feel that is accepted it may be let's say my sexuality my preferences my cultural uh bent versus this versus the

t is part of who I am integral part of who I am but I my ego in me dislikes it does not feel that is accepted it may be let's say my sexuality my preferences my cultural uh bent versus this versus the other and all of those things that I uh I'm unaware of it and I pushed it down as I come to my mind right I push them I repress it and but it's all there you're doing nothing but you think you're doing right you're becoming free but you're really uh in a very paradoxical way you become a prisoner of your own repression is that a correct uh way to to say that that's correct that's great because it's uh we say subconsciously also it's almost there in Consciousness but remember the ego is the center of Consciousness so it will allowed or not allowed contents to be inconscious it's not the same thing as Consciousness is the center of it so for something to be in Consciousness that I I know that I I recognize I know it's in my Consciousness the ego has to allow it so sometimes it doesn't even get to Consciousness okay because it's almost there and the ego it's very well put Martha because the ego then just uses a defense mechanism actually the the repression and the resistance are kind of movements of the ego okay uh and also we could say a mechanism of the fence of course but they are this beginning of no it's not going to be here okay and then we repressed or deny awesome right right denial it's like we have a small children right you are not there you are not there I don't see you I don't see you peekaboo I'm not gonna see you exactly yeah so it's a very um primitive denial it's a very primitive mechanism of Defense because it's from early of a part of the the ego is just um beginning to organize itself and the child is very frail so it doesn't exist it's not there because I don't know how to deal with that at all so it's very primitive but um so this the resistance for quickly is the strength of for the content to remain unconscious that's why we say it arises under analysis or uh in a process like that

at all so it's very primitive but um so this the resistance for quickly is the strength of for the content to remain unconscious that's why we say it arises under analysis or uh in a process like that Psychotherapy and things like that so these two movements open space for the understanding of the ego's defense mechanism as a way for the ego to protect itself from the onslaught of the unconscious so all this pressures that there are coming from the unconscious the ego feels threatens and try to know you're not there I'm not going to deal with that go back to the unconscious so it is understood that it is impossible to eliminate something that is not good or adequate whether defects or any other content that displeases the ego they will be led to the unconscious and their energy will be withdrawn but they will be directed to other objects finding another way to make themselves present as Martha was saying it's going to be there yeah I I love what we call right when humor humor is a way to to to to to bring to surface certain taboo or indices humor in society um but I always joke about the Freudian that the the famous Freudian slip where we are saying things that shouldn't be said there's some social filters for you not to say things and poof it comes out and you go I cannot believe I just said that right so I think it's there's a an interesting way to see how they are also in addition to defense mechanism also some scape if you will mechanism to to take away the pressure of all that is repressed yes and humor is actually it's it is a mechanism of defense of the ego but it's considered a let's say a evolve a mature mechanism of Defense because exactly because of this you can bring something to light but in a way that you can deal with you can of course we're not talking you know the bad humor uh when there's something yeah yeah not not good in the way that the people are making jokes or doing bullying something but the humor of finding you know of of course finding

g you know the bad humor uh when there's something yeah yeah not not good in the way that the people are making jokes or doing bullying something but the humor of finding you know of of course finding laughing with some some crazy things that we have done or thought but because it's a way to have Insight without hurting ourselves and recognize that everybody you know we are talking about stuff that everybody does every it's a way that human beings act psychically you know yeah it lower psychology several several meetings ago and I'm going to derail perhaps but I think it's it's coming to my mind uh several meetings ago we talked about um the Oscar incident a couple of years ago where uh the host makes a joke to a famous actress and he makes a joke of the fact that she's shaved her hair not knowing that there was a source of extreme pain in that relationship between this person herself and her husband right so what's so interesting here that play Dynamic with uh Chris Rock and Will Smith and his wife Jada was the fact that uh especially for African-American culture hair there's so much density of meaning into having a forehead of Hair Etc so that's number one but number two is the fact that through that uh almost bullying right uh playing a joke into something putting her down he uh the the third actor in this play comes in and and I I can just see he's he's ego like how could you diminish me in all my power as the Oscar winning in that case days Oscar we need Hector and you're putting me down therefore I want to kill you slap you whatever and unbeknownst to all of us he comes up and and he does it interestingly enough and I eat I just after we talked uh I got to see that he the actor had uh uh done an interview not so long prior to that where he had been going through a two-year in a journey about his this is this is so adequate to this conversation and I'm thinking now but he had been this two-year Journey on all his fears and including taking I think it's it's called Ayahuasca right where you you're

s is this is so adequate to this conversation and I'm thinking now but he had been this two-year Journey on all his fears and including taking I think it's it's called Ayahuasca right where you you're taking it it's hallucinatory and you you have all of these things coming out but uh he went to this journey and and his fears were I I'm losing my wife I'm losing my children I'm losing my power my influence my likability he's known to be one of the most likable actors in Hollywood and and this is the the fears that interesting enough he enacts not so long later after that interview he enacts and he loses and he almost actually lost his his relationship and the appreciation of the population and so on so forth so I think it's very interesting why right the mechanism of Defense which would be the ego saying uh I need to protect my wife in this and at the same time did not see that it was not protecting the sense of belonging and and looking good it's just interesting aspect of this discussion right the the the the the the antagonistic forces that the ego uses to protect oneself and at the same time uh in this case exposing himself to lose it all so that he could indeed face all his fears right so I think you're talking earlier about Saint Francis being the personification of exactly that Journey can you talk to us a little bit more about how losing it all he found himself yeah but I think uh first of uh this actor and this uh situation the Oscar situation it's a very good example of one of the most common mechanisms of defense that we um it's so widely used by all of us that in Psychotherapy for instance one important part of the treatment is helping the person to identify uh identify his or her projections because the mechanism is projection okay yeah and you see it is a mechanism in which the person wants to expel qualities feelings desires Etc which are refused by the ego and locates them in the other here everything that is painful would be experienced as non-ego the other is

n which the person wants to expel qualities feelings desires Etc which are refused by the ego and locates them in the other here everything that is painful would be experienced as non-ego the other is doing that to me and there or we would need to locate it in someone else so this is a very good example so of projection if the ego has to be correct and and good as you are saying about the actor that we all love the movies and other stuff then the other whoever he she may be will become the bearer of all the evil that I think to recognize in myself right for Joanna the projection achieves surprising reactions as you are saying every time someone fights with that exaggerated vehemence certain traits of another's character he projects himself or herself onto the other transferring from the ego the negative quality that is peculiar to it then the ego makes it its victim the mirror in which it is unconsciously reflected evading the acceptance of its errors and the responsibility for them so this is very important for instance paranoia okay where we have an inner persecutor actually something in usually it started it's always According to Freud but not always we can have traumas all around you know our um our life cycle okay but of course because the ego is so frail in childhood and Adolescence we have to take care because there is where uh mostly we we can get stuck in in difficult situations so for instance but anyway if I'm doing something and you talked much about psychedelics in Psychotherapy yeah and I think we should pay a lot of attention for that because uh exactly Psychotherapy analysis are ways of um you know structuring the ego maturing the ego so it can face help like Joseph Campbell says help us to serve us serve the psych right serve our evolutionary process and if we try to bypass the ego right putting the um having an altered state of consciousness and maybe this happened to him to this actor yeah because if the ego was not strong enough yet to deal with the inner persecutor like

ego right putting the um having an altered state of consciousness and maybe this happened to him to this actor yeah because if the ego was not strong enough yet to deal with the inner persecutor like fears or things like that or other inner images complexes whatever that were threatening the ego what I do many times is like there is a trigger there's always a trigger a guy that was bullying but of course the guy that was bullying was also projecting something right everybody was projecting in everybody yeah so for different reasons because of the the conscious uh the unconscious contents of yes everyone involved so what you do if you don't recognize that you have for instance those fears to to get them your to go back to your example then the you are going to create an inner persecutor for instance because you are repressing denying whatever so you are going to have to project because the energy is there and yeah we're going to have to project in somebody so that guy was persecuting him let's say in psychologically speaking uh because was bullying was threatening His Image was bringing to light in a very certain way when of course he was emotional and all this stuff the actor so the other guy who was bullying was bringing to life to to light uh persecuting all those fears okay so but that was projection uh you see that Joanna says with um every time someone fights with exaggerated fear correct correct right it's exaggerated because the guy was was being very not only unpolite it was showing all this you know awful traits of character yeah so if I just don't connect to that it's not mine it's your problem yeah the jealousy for instance or whatever because it was not human that's not humor yeah you know that's uh of course projection and aggressiveness disguised as humor yeah so if I don't connect to that I have already I am in contact with my contents I don't have to project so that doesn't belong to me then I wouldn't have for instance uh you know so such a strong emotional response

t connect to that I have already I am in contact with my contents I don't have to project so that doesn't belong to me then I wouldn't have for instance uh you know so such a strong emotional response I can be of course not happy with the thing but I can understand that it doesn't belong to me I won't say anything I will go there and I'm you know you were being very unpolite but if you think this is humorous that's your problem not mine correct yeah and goodbye or whatever or say the message that was more important thanks to my wife and everybody that has the same problem have hope because medicine this and that then would be positive but then you would have to have already deal with those contents so a message that I want to to live to everyone that's just a small Insight in the mechanism of Defense let's not be afraid of ourselves let's go like Joanna is telling us with courage facing ourselves with strong and mature egos so we can evolve all together and not project or repress or deny so much uh you know onto others and it's it's a it's a just uh quoting back uh with my own words uh it's it's a hero's journey right uh as as Joseph Campbell uh talked about it we are at the end of our uh talk today we'll meet again in the in the a few weeks just wanted to to give the the just a a one sentence uh to tell everybody that if you can read read about uh Saint Francis and Sinclair in their personification of how they're able to let go of the ego in in get in touch with their own Consciousness will maybe bring that again and also I think just to say goodbye and remember now that you asked me it's so much things to talk about oh my God uh I wanted to give you all to take home one sentence of young that I think it's what Saint Francis uh you know um also went through Jung says I'm not what happened to me I am what I choose to become love it he chose Saint Francis chose to become some Francis in a way uh going through this inner journey and connecting with uh his higher self awesome awesome well we we

I am what I choose to become love it he chose Saint Francis chose to become some Francis in a way uh going through this inner journey and connecting with uh his higher self awesome awesome well we we are at the end I just want to say thank you thank you thank you everyone who was able to to join us today or in the future and uh this this uh amazing time together is wonderful I appreciate you and I appreciate appreciate all of you who can join us on a weekly basis goodbye bye bye everyone foreign