Ep 66 - The Evolution of Human Thought

hi everyone welcome to the psychology and spirituality a bridge to Better Life discussion I'm your host Marcia Tran and with me is my good friend Dr Susanna Simo if this is the first time you're watching this podcast Live program please do note that our program psychology and spirituality weekly talk are based on the works by Jonah d'angeles and it is a program with the focus to offer a safe space for us to perhaps confront compare correlate and expand on spirituality Concepts from a psychological lens today Susanna Simon will be sharing some thoughts around the evolution of human thoughts so very interesting but before we start a conversation Susan I would like to recognize the organization that is sponsoring this program and they include the m d the United States Spirits Federation the international Spirits Council and Amy Brazil make sure you hit subscribe if you haven't already done so and if you'd like to check out other channels other information please do go to www.sirius.com if you have any questions I'd love to hear from you write them down and we will uh answer them address them at a later episode suzan how you doing I'm good I'm good thank you thank you for having me again here in this program awesome Susanna can you tell us a little bit about this notion that uh everything is in God's time right maybe you can walk us through the idea of human evolution and how we humans right you and I and the entire human race perhaps have evolved in how we're able to think process our mental and emotional states well um let me just start by saying that this is a very fascinating topic thatana brings in the book in times of um peace and health um and uh is the very first chapter of the book where she talks about the evolution of human uh thinking and it might feel like kind of dance for people to consider why would I be reading about that what is the relevance of that and what drew me towards the study of this particular chapter was the fact that I experience in my life and in relating

ople to consider why would I be reading about that what is the relevance of that and what drew me towards the study of this particular chapter was the fact that I experience in my life and in relating with others this very common topic where which is human suffering anguish and anxiety about their own evolutionary process um when it comes to their Enlightenment and a lot of the anguish comes from this sense of Rush and this sense that we are lagging behind and that we are not meeting God's expectations of how fast we should be moving and so and a lot of times we feel that we are stuck that we are not progressing that we are not doing what we're supposed to be doing and again that adds an incredible painful layer to a life that is already difficult so understanding the evolution of human thought understanding the time that it took for us to get where we are and understanding where we are with the perspective of this evolutionary process really changes the way we perceive we understand and our perspective in the present moment and I think it really um erases or or takes away some of these uh anguish which is what spiritism does best it's elevates us and gives us a much broader perspective in life reframing our perceptions and understanding of the present moment so let's go to this right Susan let's go to this this journey and I'd love to hear from you feel free to just talk about this evolutionary path with the goal for that all of us you and me and everybody who's here with us today to understand slow down right right slow down there's a time for everything and it doesn't mean that we need to just sit down and do nothing and remain distracted we've become a very distracted Society by the way but from the perspective of this desire this calling for all of us to to rush toward our sense of Enlightenment of our sense of uh individuation of Happiness right we have time so go ahead suzan I'm really eager to hear from you yes yes and hopefully by the end and I would love to get back to this we'll be able

of our sense of uh individuation of Happiness right we have time so go ahead suzan I'm really eager to hear from you yes yes and hopefully by the end and I would love to get back to this we'll be able to set some smart goals for ourselves um which is you know um goals that make sense and they are much more in line with our stage of evolution as opposed to G goals that are unachievable and anxiety provoking so if we think about the evolution right so we don't have a full understanding I think that that's the first thing that I want to say uh of the process of evolution we don't we have some ideas but we don't know all the ins and outs um we do know that um when we first created um we were not yet a conscience as we have today uh with awareness of the self for instance awareness of God um so in the spiritual philosophy it is called the intelligent principle it's like the very beginning so this intelligent principle which I cannot Define to you other than it's not Material it is um intellectual it does not die does not undergo transformations in the way the matter does because it's not Material so but this is the beginning of the intelligent life and this in this principle will develop itself uh into uh as a ghost through different stages and different species until the moment that he becomes um individualized in the sense that it gains awareness right so this Evolution process and any Evolution process and this again it's just a very basic so if you were coming to this for the very first time never heard of spiritism don't those don't know much we have to put at least some building blocks to help you to understand so um The Evolution whether we're talking about this uh principle or whether we're talking about uh the the the spirit which is the human Spirit The Evolution happens in both planes of life when we engage with the material reality and we we are disengaged of the material reality so this explains some um leaps some changes that we cannot find find the links in the material realm but that

when we engage with the material reality and we we are disengaged of the material reality so this explains some um leaps some changes that we cannot find find the links in the material realm but that might be and happen in the spiritual realm so they can I just say just one thing right so the duality of our spiritual Dimension versus our materal Dimensions is recognized but U if you think in terms of the evolution of human thought it's also important for us uh to to frame it in the aspect of in our corpor Corporal experience our Incarnation our life we are essentially bio social beings right so there is a organic and a inter relationship component that social component that also takes a a yet another um perspective to this discussion so we have a spiritual material and within the material there's the organic evolution AR process as well as the social aspect of the gregarious nature of humanity yes absolutely so all those work together synergistically for um the human for the evolution of this principle and also for the human um Evolution so um so going on uh uh with that um so there is a moment as I was saying where these uh principle becomes um aware of itself and there's that leap into what we call like the human uh spirit again um Devolution is going to take place um in between the two the two Realms now once we get to um and what this is one of the very beautiful things thatana uh talks about which is it shows the presence of God within taking care of us as a loving presence as this this Force this Progressive force that you know it's always within us this Force for evolution and so this force of Love moving us forward and providing us so we bring from the spiritual reality the instincts the Tendencies the the forces that actually drive the process so that is one aspect that you know we we try to teach people about the presence of God in our days today but God has always been uh both outside and within us as this uh very uh guiding and loving force uh propelling us forward and this is

e try to teach people about the presence of God in our days today but God has always been uh both outside and within us as this uh very uh guiding and loving force uh propelling us forward and this is true up to uh our times today so as the the intelligent principle as the spirit evolve there is a correlation with the evolution of the physical body so the the Improvement the the the Improvement of the the the Consciousness leads to the Improvement of the the body as well in other words the body becomes more um specialized for instance so you take the the the human brain the human brain um you know from the moment that we stood up on two feet um has continued to evolve like very significantly in response to the evolution of the spirit the experiences the the challenges the development of intelligence so it really correlates so if you look at you know and we're talking about the homo um uh species right so we're talking about the moment that we standing on two feet now and we're looking at the homo Erectors the homo neales and all these species that come before our Homo sapiens today so we were on two feet but our brain wasn't finished it continued to develop so if you look at the very first uh homo um varieties right their brain for instance the frontal lobe was significantly smaller than the frontal lobe in our brains today so we have evolved and when we look at these homos species we're talking about their appearance perhaps um 200,000 years ago after the entire like we're talking millions of years years of evolution to get us to this point where the brain itself had a development where um we call the Triune brain uh so we had like initially uh the development of the brain area that was um responsible for the instincts which is the very first uh brain uh that J will mention uh the reptile brain yeah so it helps us to survive and then um later on you have the develop of the memo brain which is related to the lyic area and the appearance of the first emotions all these

ion uh the reptile brain yeah so it helps us to survive and then um later on you have the develop of the memo brain which is related to the lyic area and the appearance of the first emotions all these areas they are compatible with our level of evolution and all these areas are necessary for the preparation of the next area so initially we are primary and overwhelmingly instincts we here on this planet dealing with a very hostile unknown world without being able to make any sense of it without being able to understand the reality that we are in we see things we have no idea what they are we have no idea what they're there for we have no idea how to interact with them this is us this this looks like a horror movie right you're inserted in the middle of a context and things are coming at you but we have that Reptilian Brain helping us survive right to survive right so at some point we start to developing some emotions our brain evolves through the observation of this hostile environment so we start to notice that hey some days or sometime there's light sometimes there is no light some days are cold some days are hot sometimes we see someone who is moving and on the next day that person might not be moving anymore and not move ever again and so what is all that about so we start to slowly by looking at Nature by looking at the animals oh the animals protect themselves um oh these um the thunder struck the the tree and now there's fire oh maybe and fire is hot and I'm cold and so we we we we spend a long time right making sense of of of the world outside of us uh understanding for instance the concept of Seasons there's seasons there different times of the year where flowers bloom where trees don't have any leaves or where the leaves are falling and all that kind of stuff so we go from a what should call the Prem magic stage uh of of uh thought Evolution where we could not make any sense of anything around us to what she is going to call the Magic Moment yeah the Magic Moment is where okay now we

call the Prem magic stage uh of of uh thought Evolution where we could not make any sense of anything around us to what she is going to call the Magic Moment yeah the Magic Moment is where okay now we are starting to understand things we're starting to have some emotions we we afraid of things we start to gather in groups we start to protect then we now understanded their seasions um we start to develop some tools we start to hang around in groups so we can protect ourselves and we start to build shelters so we can protect ourselves from the environment but think of this we are talking about an incredible amount of ears and a correlation between the development of the spirit and the development of the brain a brain that is being developed in other words becoming more sophisticated is increasing its neuronal activities its connections through these very hardcore experiences so this is important because I also when I think about this and I talk about this and I was reflecting about this I was studying the image of a seed came to mind right so the seed is buried into this very cold dark hostile environment and yet environment that has all the nutrients in the absolutely best circumstances for it to break through the thick um outside right the the skin um which is thick but it calls for the hostile environment and then with the the force of God within it's able to break through and starts to navigate the soil until we reach the surface and breaks through the light so I like and there's yeah there's a great Paradox in itself right yeah the the the protection and I'm just thinking out loud here Susanna but uh the protection of the survival instincts was the protection of the seed but once it immerses in the next phase which is sprouting uh it it goes into this so-called adverse environment it's h it's it's uh cold and it's it's dark and it's da da but it's exactly what that plant in this case in the metaphor needs to to bloom and become something else and it's quite beautiful very lcal as

's h it's it's uh cold and it's it's dark and it's da da but it's exactly what that plant in this case in the metaphor needs to to bloom and become something else and it's quite beautiful very lcal as well so thanks for sharing that no yeah and what made me want to say that is because you said wow this sounds so cruel and and um but it's actually perfectly loving and divine in the sense that you know it it's God providing us with the absolute absolutely perfect environment for us to bloom right and because of the coarse nature of our spirit it takes a hostile environment to to nurture and to to challenge us and to Foster those connections at the brain level at the Mind level that would that will later allow the spirit to manifest its potential in order to manifest thinking reason and logic we also need a brain that is capable of these uh manifestation so it's like you can have a outstanding ponist with a very uh awful piano uh he will not be able to show talent because the machine is not compatible so it's very and let me tell you something yeah because because I think it's also good in that sense of the timing that it takes for the brain to devel like the piano you need a better piano to to to be able for that talent to be expressed appropriately uh it's not a SL switch ever right we don't come from very primitive homo Erectors Etc to Homo sapiens it it takes that time to grow at a physical uh aspect but also spiritual and then when we're ready then we're ready to become self-aware and I think that's what you're talking about that that the the brain functions required for this sense of self and sense of self-awareness right yeah no absolutely so there's a very um straight correlation uh between uh the two of them and so we continue to evolve so Janna talks about in this chapter about this Prem magic period where again we could not relate with the outside world to the magic one where things start to make sense and we start to have um to act on the external to control the

pter about this Prem magic period where again we could not relate with the outside world to the magic one where things start to make sense and we start to have um to act on the external to control the external we develop tools and now we start to uh we we now uh use metal which says we'll change the face of the world once we start using Metals in our daily lives and we start we start to to exchange and from that point on WE progress we make progress progress to the next phase which is going to call the egocentric uh stage so right here we get into that phase where if I don't get what I want I will go for it right so she talks about being a phase where there's the Revival of our of our very in most aggressive instincts and this was a phase that was necessary to prepare us for the next phase so we we will learn it's it's tough but it Prov provides consequences that will hopefully take us and teach us to reflect this is not working this is causing me pain so maybe there's a different way of doing things maybe I should consider a different way of doing things because at the end it doesn't help for us to be killing one another we must have a different way of relating so this is not the final stage but I just want to open open a parenthesis to say that this entric stage of thinking seems to me to remain very prevalent in our society today I was going to say exactly that we feel that the world was created around us right that we are at the epicenter of the world of the universe and we must the sun must shine because of me and it's a very self-centered very entric uh view of the world but some of us maybe even most of us right Susanna feel that way that uh it's all about me yeah and and again and and she she's going to talk a little bit more about um instincts and how prevalent uh they um remain uh on us but yes so that's that's that's a stage of the evolution so we went to Prem magical to magical to the egocentric in the last stage which the stage that we we are now it's would be

y um remain uh on us but yes so that's that's that's a stage of the evolution so we went to Prem magical to magical to the egocentric in the last stage which the stage that we we are now it's would be the rational uh stage so in these stage we start to make better sense we are able to to reason we able to have uh all the advances that we see in terms of um um uh technolog science all the the virtual um realities that we are uh experience nowadays and we have uh the prolongation of life for example the advances of medicine and all that type of stuff our life should be less afflictive and we have uh achieve a stage where and this is a very fascinating uh idea here where because we have now control over the external world we not we not only Now understand the external we are able to to manage we can control we have power over it of course to some extent there are some things that some nature but you know what I'm saying yeah so the the the rational thought period is a thought is a period where we should be Focus focusing on the The Proposal of true fraternity and solidarity as well as we should now be leaving in such a a comfortable uh way uh externally that it's the time to do the same Journey that we did inwards yes because we don't have any more uh the concerns and the fears and the challenges with nature that has been conquered we I'm talking to you from the comfort of my home they she on I have light I have a computer it's all comfortable we're settled that way and so we had to be this way we had to First travel outwards to develop our thinking ability to uh helps us with the uh sophistication of our brain so that now we can say I'm in a safe place I don't have to worry about you know being attacked by a lion whatever but I can now take the time to do the same because now the Lions the storms the fires the unknown the darkness is all within and it's quite beautiful it's it's frightening right it's frightening but just like the little image of the seed we have exactly what we need to conquer

he fires the unknown the darkness is all within and it's quite beautiful it's it's frightening right it's frightening but just like the little image of the seed we have exactly what we need to conquer yet this new stage of development absolutely beautiful yes and um and we have again if you look at the law of progress and um in kardak in the spirits book we know that the development of intelligent precedes the moral development precisely because now we have reached a stage of reasion where we can better determine what is good and evil or in more psychological terms what is um helps us with the flow of life or what prevents us from moving forward what hurts and what heals and we are able to make more conscious and educated choices for our eles and for um others but what Jan brings up in this chapter that I feel it's to me the absolutely most important concept um that can really help us suiting our anxieties going back to the very beginning of our conversation and I did take that sentence out and I have here so allow me to read it because absolutely uh fantastic when she says after the extremely long passage to the phase of instinctual and condition reflexes the very short time since the attainment of logical thinking has not yet allowed the homo sapiens to overcome deeply ingrained automatis in order to act in better ways rather than always react their archetypes remain aggressive and defensive and their behavior is dictated more by the ego than by the self requiring ongoing effort to overcome their uh their in uh inferior inclinations so I think that this is really important for us to reflect in terms of our Evolution because we get fooled by the intellectual advances we get um yeah so we we look at the world outside and we see we think we are so civilized we are so Advanced yes we are intellectually we have done an incredible great job but Jan highlights in the text that it's been only 10,000 years um out of the 200,000 or even more that we have been up on two feet and looking more or less

tually we have done an incredible great job but Jan highlights in the text that it's been only 10,000 years um out of the 200,000 or even more that we have been up on two feet and looking more or less like we look today only the last 10,000 years that we have really achieved a level of reasoning and thinking that we are today and here she's highlighting the the fact that you know an extremely long Passage through the Instinct and the condition reflects a very short time since we attain this highest level of thinking so these instincts are very very ingrain on us so the idea Mars here is that every day when we get up and we go out to leave and to relate we taking our uh weapons with us we are going out into societ within our armors we have our Shield we are constant we remain somewhat in this survival mode which if it's not because we think we're going to be trespassed by a sword it is because we feel threaten emotionally it's almost like very tribal right if you think about in the history of recent relatively recent history of mankind it's very tribal I'm a warrior and I'm here to protect my My Tribe my clan my family but that puts me in a position to always look in fear for any external stimuli that may disrupt my family whereas what you're saying is that it's gone gone the time is gone we don't need that we can just relax and invert our investment of uh discovery of uh even Warrior type Warrior like type of activities inside of us do does this make sense yes yes but this needs to be taken within God's time and here's where I want to say it yes this is the whole point of this conversation it took millions of years yes to get us to where we are it's insane to expect that it will take one Incarnation two incarnations for us to overcome this which Jan is telling us with all letters and words we are still in a reactive stage so our reason and our thinking has not been trained yet enough to override the instincts because this is really what characterizes Humanity what makes us

ers and words we are still in a reactive stage so our reason and our thinking has not been trained yet enough to override the instincts because this is really what characterizes Humanity what makes us humans is the ability to using rational thinking to analyze the situation and say my my body tells me that this is a threat because someone disagree with me and now my heart rate is going up my body the animal in me is feeling a threat but I understand that the fact that someone thinks differently than me doesn't make that person my enemy doesn't make me inferior my life my emotional life is not threatened therefore I am going to breathe I am going to calm down my central nervous system and instead of reacting to this I am going to say something in line with my humanity and not in line with the reptile that remains within me yeah there's a book uh suzan I don't know if you read it's um very uh it's by a psychologist and Economist uh Daniel kenman of thinking fast and slow that addresses that in in a way very data centered type of discussions on how we still are thinking in the fast fast mode in the fast mode is that instinctive type of brain function that we need to survive right he invites us also to to slow down and to embrace the slow thinking which is what you you're talking about from Joana d'angeles right right so so look we are now in a time where science is is catching up with this absolutely so we're looking at you know works like this we look at the whole the whole Paradigm of mindfulness yeah um it's related to that right there is many many Trends in spirituality that you know if you look at the practice of yoga I mean there are many ways in which the spiritual realm is telling us yes not only through spiritualism but through all religions and spiritual in many different ways sometimes things have different names but Essence of the teaching is the same it's like if the spiritual world is telling us okay let let me give you tools so that you guys can start practicing being human um I

things have different names but Essence of the teaching is the same it's like if the spiritual world is telling us okay let let me give you tools so that you guys can start practicing being human um I love I love it let's yes less be human right less be humans right so we have this incredible anxiety of being good of being perfect of being pure forget about all that going back to the smart goals so this is it it took millions of years for us to get here right it's been only 10,000 years since we start actually using our brains in the in more efficient waysan is telling us that those instincts are still deeply ingrained in us so when you look at this reality now you can say to yourself what is the goal that I want to set for my Incarnation right what is achievable because the smart goals are achievable if you set for yourself a goal that you cannot achieve you will get into depression and anxiety and you're going to take medication you don't need to you don't need I love it I love it just just just understand that it is like that it is a slow because real real changes take time and you need to for the for the seed for the plant before the plant breaks the soil in a more upright movement towards the light it spent a long time expanding the roots in the under the ground in parallel uh in in horizontal uh ways so this is it and and and one important aspect that kardak will talk about and I kind of like to make the connection with what Jan is saying here because she's going to to to say that she ends that statement saying that's going to take ongoing effort to overcome the inferior inclinations and so when kardak talks to us about for example what is a true spir is is's going to say the spirits are recognized by moral trans transformation in the efforts to overcome the uh evil inclinations but what is interesting about this is that when you look at the French um uh work uh of the spirit's book and even the the the Brazilian translation the word uses not overcome the word uses tame yes now tame and

interesting about this is that when you look at the French um uh work uh of the spirit's book and even the the the Brazilian translation the word uses not overcome the word uses tame yes now tame and overcome two different things yes taming can lead to overcoming eventually but theming means that you have an instinct a wild Instinct that you are training so that instinct does not manifest in that wild way but it's almost like a Zen Buddhist view of of that wildness that exists in us right yeah but but but something pain yeah doesn't mean that disappear it means that it's under control yes right yes whereas when you talk about overcoming you're talking about winning so it will come a point so when Jesus for instance right when Jesus is um um attacked or or or whatever was he taming his uh tendency to hurt back or he had already overcome that maybe maybe in being a physical body we don't I'm speculating here he might had physiological responses but no tendency no inclination whatsoever ever ever in thought or in any other way to retaliate it was completely overcome because because for you to have that tenis you have to have fear and you have to feel threatened in first place if you don't have fear and you don't have a sense of being threat you will not react to that right so I think that that's really interesting because in terms of of evolution this is where we are we are taming right so I feel that I I try to do that very consciously in my life um whenever I feel my heart racing whenever I feel my muscles tighten up whenever I I feel that my syndrome of system has gotten into that flight and fight mode I say okay he's an opportun sometimes I'm successful sometimes I'm not sometimes it's faster than me right I boom I go and I react but I try I try stop breathe think and act right so that's the place where we have understand you having all these feelings you're angry you are you know distressed where's that coming from how are you feeling what is underneath right are you

right so that's the place where we have understand you having all these feelings you're angry you are you know distressed where's that coming from how are you feeling what is underneath right are you feeling diminished are you you feeling you know why are you so upset what is that telling you about you and then be able to come up with uh with an action that um does not compromise um my life even more it does not create more problems so this is kind of one of the the the goals can we live this lifetime um if not significantly better a little better that's great can we start kind kind of balancing out our spiritual account so that you know we are kind of moving towards a positive um balance and not creating more negative not withdrawing more and more and more right so making some small deposits of kindness and altruistic um actions that can help us to have a healthier um balance account in the infinite I love it the thought that came to my mind and I know we're coming to the end and I I love the the smart goals right is it achievable yes we can achieve that but what comes to my mind uh crazy as it is Susanna is that instead of flipping into living 100% or 90% of our energy in that very reactive very primitive Reptilian Brain if we can maybe start to think about it as I don't know let's spend 60% of our energy in in the neocortex right the the the rational brain maybe 40% not 40 30% in our emotional mamillion brain and there's room for that 10% left which is The Reptilian the reactive uh instinctive brain because we may go through some times where we are going to be vulnerable to attacks or whatever but start to flip the coin let's uh let's understand there's time for that we like you said we don't live anymore in the sub Sahara Savannah with lionesses coming at us hunting us no this is gone this is past we have time to really be the best that we can be in our own humanness but but at the same hand like you said I think we live in a world that is still not safe um and it's not going

gone this is past we have time to really be the best that we can be in our own humanness but but at the same hand like you said I think we live in a world that is still not safe um and it's not going to be safe until we um move out of these uh kind of selfish self-centered mode that we live in that's on K in the the book um apus work there's a beautiful dissertation about uh how selfishness um will never allow us to feel safe uh because we're always competing and we are always uh in the defensive uh mode so um there are times where like the instincts are necessary um and um and in in even in the times where we already have the possibility to override it but we don't we shouldn't feel horrible we shouldn't we shouldn't uh nail us to a cross and you know and punish ourselves because you know it's important to recognize that that's very much our nature so but the fact that it's our nature doesn't mean that is our destination that's not you know the reality that will have to be so it's a balance between Consciousness and kindness um love it love it yeah Consciousness kindness and commitment I would say so you conscious you're kind to yourself and most important you committed to the process you don't give up you you you keep going and you can make very simple goals such as say let me observe my day today let's see if within my day and the difficult situations I will face today I can one time in my day bring that awareness and actually make a conscious choice for myself that's simple that is achievable that's one day at a time time that is within it matches our level of evolution it's a kind goal it's achievable it's generous and it's loving so that's that's that's something think K tries to tell us yes I love it using a Cooperative language let's use that as our smart goal for today for the year for the life and uh Susanna we are at time unfortunately but I just want to say thank you I really enjoy our conversation today I really enjoyed you using the words from from the book by

for the year for the life and uh Susanna we are at time unfortunately but I just want to say thank you I really enjoy our conversation today I really enjoyed you using the words from from the book by Jonah d'angeles to to give this this you know this broad brush Strokes about human evolution and the invitation for all of us to to read those books to familiarize but most importantly be kind be generous be committed with that I'll see you next time thank you so much by bye