Ep 87 - Inside Out - Getting to Know our Emotions (Fear)

hi everyone welcome to the psychology in spirituality aeach to Better Life discussion I'm your host mercan and with me is our program founder Jada corn go hi Jada how's everything on your hand W everything is great I'm happy to be here again and doing this work that we love so much thank you hello everyone welcome back thank you thank you everyone who's here with us but for those that uh have never seen this program before in other words if this is your first time you're watching this podcast please note that our program the psychology in spirituality weekly thoughts are based on the works by Joanna d'angeles and we're here to offer all of us you Jada and myself I safe space to perhaps bring and expand spirituality Concepts from a psychological lens and bringing insights to all of us but we're here today to talk about fear and fear can manifest in so many different forms each with its own characteristics each with its own series of impacts on all of us examples may include include oh existential fear social anxiety PTSD or perhaps fear of failure of intimacy of change fear is so pervasive in our lives and I'm really Keen today jadaa on talking to you about potential approaches for dealing with fear and of course to do this we need a a baseline what what are we talking about in based on what so love to to hear from you um if we can speak about fear from the perspective of Joan and d'angels but before we start our conversation in Earnest I would like to recognize the very important organizations that are supporting this program TV mandino the United States spiritist Federation the international spiritist Council and in Brazil thank you very much all organizations for your continued sponsorship for you who may be here for the first time or not and you haven't hit subscribe please do so so you can get to this program faster if you want to hear more please uh go to spiritist that us there's lots of information that can elucidate other questions and if you have questions please write them down

an get to this program faster if you want to hear more please uh go to spiritist that us there's lots of information that can elucidate other questions and if you have questions please write them down love to hear from you your insights feedback critique and most important your question Jada I believe that many of us uh at least I am and I think you are too who are interested in Psychology may have watched a very very insightful movie and actually it has a a sequel right so it's inside out and inside out too and I find those just amazing and quite timless the sequel that was released in August 2024 features that main character the girl her name is Riley and now Riley is entering puberty Riley with this you know no longer child but now in her PR years is experienced and in addition to the emotions that we we we were acquainted with um with in the first movie so there I believe they Joy anger sadness disgust and fear right but now Riley as a pretin start to get new emotions in this movie not a spoiler just to know that there are two additional emotions right so they are um much more complex and uh requires like anyone out there including myself and you right just had when we were at that age um to now deal with anxiety Envy boredom and embarrassment oh my it is so so hard to go through life and transition into adulthood but I just I just thought maybe we can devote our time today to talk about fear one of the these emotions and perhaps uh really look to what did Joanna the angelist give to us bring to us in her beautiful body of work about this specific emotion so again hello everyone thank you Mar you I think that's a a fascinating topic and um uh for all purposes the movies that we are mentioning are directed to Children and Youth but uh I think it resonates so much in all of us even some I've been hearing that um therapists have been commented about uh or commenting about the movies as well as being an a very important too for you know for them to deal with children that needed attention

e been hearing that um therapists have been commented about uh or commenting about the movies as well as being an a very important too for you know for them to deal with children that needed attention in the sense and uh even if uh you know like you said Riley is going to puber through uh puberty and um uh but but I mean when we we are watching it we we feel ourselves in there as well so those are emotions that uh let's say initiates us into adult hood and are going to be following us in the case of fear for instance from the perspective of the the benefactor Jan deangeles and she has several books that mention fear in fact uh she she talks about fear as being a human experience we don't go through human experience without having experienced you know fear um every other day you know um and but in a way she says that we can we can look at the positive aspect that is a protective mechanism so that yes will uh be like a an alert to for us to avoid getting your ourselves into trouble so we'll be recognizing situations that may be dangerous as um although we can say that in a way fear and ex anxiet to walk U hand in hand they are not the same and Al like we uh when we were analyzing anxiety we also said about the benefits about of the anxiety and how you know we can come naturally naturally in in a natural way in situations of Life uh when about fear is the same thing but as all those emotions that some sometimes times we have a tendency of already placing them in the negative side of emotions uh they are not necessarily there for us to explore the negative sides or to give ourselves into that and and I I even think sorry to interrupt just but I do think this is a social uh cultural construct this idea that perhaps being sad is a very negative aspect of an experience and in likewise fear is is very there's a negative uh judgment about it uh so I think it's very important for you to to bring that up those are basic emotions they have a protective uh nature to to all of us therefore we should not only

e's a negative uh judgment about it uh so I think it's very important for you to to bring that up those are basic emotions they have a protective uh nature to to all of us therefore we should not only honor them but welcome them as we we as we feel them right pay attention to them and you see this is something that we get conditions over time that it starts when in our childhood or ear as teenager years as well when you know we have this I dare you to do that you know oh yeah to DARE me to do something it's because it's something that we shouldn't be doing right dangerous to you uh and so you know we are um kind of touch that having this kind of emotion is because I'm a coward is is something negative and um and in a way when we become adults it it it it is hard for us to admit that you know yeah I feel fear just other was watching a movie and the guy is having some health problems and very difficult ones and and then someone ask get for for him are you afraid of dying and we are going to be talking about it but you know it was hard for him to admit um right away that yes he was afraid he had fear of it and because you know I'm an adult I'm a guy I'm you know and so you have to uh make believe that no that's fine it's part of life and and so we are so uh afraid of showing ourselves and and showing that you know this is this is common sense you know some kind of situations they will bring fear so here when she she J deangeles talks about the natural fear in the same way that we were talking um weeks ago about natural anxiety of course go through a path where it's going to become a problem when it will dominate me in a way that will hinder my pursue of self- knowledge of spiritual growth and uh kind of paralyzing us you know uh uh I'm not going to DARE I'm not going to you know I'm not happy with my work but I'm not going to look for another one what if what if what if and this or this can happen it's not just anxiety is is being afraid being afraid the fear that is

you know I'm not happy with my work but I'm not going to look for another one what if what if what if and this or this can happen it's not just anxiety is is being afraid being afraid the fear that is actually manifesting so and it's yeah and it's negative well yes and it's interesting because there's research that talks about in the we're talking about Human Experience right the past I don't know 10,000 years of humanity where from a gender perspective women right not only statistically speaking we we see that women fall prey to to anxiety pathological anxiety much more than than men um fear is something that women use to to historically speaking to protect their children right so understanding and being alert and I'm looking to my sides here as if there is something lurking well if there is then children come on in let's let's protect ourselves let's not be out in the elements if you will but what's so beautiful if you think about it is countering as you're saying just countering this natural tendency to to see fear as a a a a trigger to something's going on let me go ahead and protect me and my my my loved ones right there's something that counters to this uh which is the idea of growing developing and doing that by um achieving or being challenged right so that once we overcome whatever challenge may be then we we go into a a higher platform a higher level of this this experience that is life so I think it's very it's almost this point Counterpoint that we see very often in in Joanna the angelist work which is on one hand yes it's part on the other hand if we allow fear to paralyze us we will not be able to really grow it's and it's interesting that you brought about the example of the mother for instance with her children because again this like I said we are conditioned since early childhood to fear the world so be careful when you you know you are on the street H don't stranger uh don't eat don't eat uh ice cream because it's going to make you feel ill or you know it's so many things and so

fear the world so be careful when you you know you are on the street H don't stranger uh don't eat don't eat uh ice cream because it's going to make you feel ill or you know it's so many things and so as a child and and and unfortunately you know because U of course we are growing as the spirits and we hope that for next time we will be together but you know this is a way uh that we find uh of educating our children in the same way that sometimes you know some religions especially in the the the past would come in and and bring so much fear you know if you think think about it you're going to hell and I fear so much uh all this perspective but there is one qu quote from Joanna deangeles in the book existential conflicts that caught my attention when she says I mean about this uh crazy notion of us always being worried about our future and here anxiety this isn't a fear what can happen you know this or if I don't do that and she says the future is a blank slate that is painted with the colors of our present actions so if I'm a you know paralyzed because I'm afraid that something might happen in the future uh I I I I if I I I may be you know completely oblivious to working and accepting responsibility to do what I have to do today even to prevent that or to make sure that it's not going to happen and and so you know uh in another book moms of health and Consciousness all of them published by Le publisher she talks about fear as being an illusion created by by the mind of course it is an illusion because it's something that we are imagining right that um is going to happen like if I go out in the streets and talk to a stranger maybe this a stranger is going I don't know kidnap me you know and I start imagining things that did not happen so that's why we said that in a way in certain situations fear and anxiety walk hand in hand absolutely a and and so um her advice is always for us to go and seek uh self-awareness you know to to to pay attention to that to this conditioning

rtain situations fear and anxiety walk hand in hand absolutely a and and so um her advice is always for us to go and seek uh self-awareness you know to to to pay attention to that to this conditioning that we have and we have received it in our family Dynamics things that yeah we were young of course out of love as a way of protecting us in the same way that you know our parents our grandparents learn same methodology Dynamic so to say now we are in this dynamic as well and and the thing is that sometime times because we are so used to this kind of dynamic we are the ones that I are sabotaging our growth our personal growth because what is Su Siege right the big question that sometimes you know fear can really get into the way and and and if you think about it right um Jada it's very interesting because this this fear of failure right fear of not uh uh meeting the expectations it's truly uh from that perspective it is based on a cultural uh environment that you inserted your family in this case but it it is also uh very much an egoic construct right as the ego uh projects those desire or this drive to meet the demands of external uh life so culturally speaking if I live I don't know pick a country right let's say I don't know Australia and immediately comes to my mind all the animals that are so exotic uh enormous um um tangaro oh or or sharks or life is is is because of nature is that you right you're very much faced with the this extensive territory but if we think about it for you to to live be born and live in that environment the fears are much more different than mine living say in an urban city in the US or for you J or for somebody else simply s in the world so I think it's very interesting that we have to understand ego is ego fear sorry fear is there to protect us right there is a a lot of research that talks about this gender based uh uh relation with fear and now we come to this third remark which is is the fact that it is relative to your environment

tect us right there is a a lot of research that talks about this gender based uh uh relation with fear and now we come to this third remark which is is the fact that it is relative to your environment and may be different but it's it's regardless it's an egoic construct that differs B based on what is your uh outside expectation familiar uh familial or cultural uh it there's a change based I don't know East versus West if I I am born in a very um rural area or not or if I'm born say in Africa or or I don't know the Netherlands very different aspects of what are the fears that I have in in in my life right one of the main um consequence that fear can really get in the way and becoming become a a terrible culprit in our lives is is uh preventing us going into the process of self- knowledge which is key in the work of Shan deangeles and then the work of you know that we have in spiritism everything is about you know getting to know ourselves analyzing who we are not just be behind the ego the Persona the facade that we we have but really to try to analyze ourselves but of course if I I I I don't want to see that I I'm afraid of looking at my shadowy side I'm I'm I'm going to be preventing myself of to go through this path of you know getting to normal myself and and do something about it in the path to to self-improvement so uh this self knowledge and how the fear can be an obstacle to to that also uh entails another problem gives put it to together with uh our self-esteem right because if I have a low self-esteem I my first thought in terms of being fearful of what is going to be revealed if I dive deep into myself in this process of self- knowledge correct that you know whatever I'm going to find in myself that is not right instead of making me act in you know in a proactive uh kind of way of thinking what can I do to improve this aspect that is still needs to be improved myself I'm going to use that as a negative thing saying know the lack of selfworth see I'm no good I don't have

way of thinking what can I do to improve this aspect that is still needs to be improved myself I'm going to use that as a negative thing saying know the lack of selfworth see I'm no good I don't have that and this is a problem yeah so let me see if I can break it down for myself right um um the idea of fear has two additional wrinkles right number one which is a as a barrier to our self- knowledge uh which is in itself the the biggest goal as we can see when we study I'm a student of Jonah d'angel so as a student Jonah d' Angels you start to see that coming through in just about every book that she she writes right uh the the idea of this is at the end what we need to do is to become more aware of who we are and as a matter of fact this is really the the the biggest uh the the the the the skeleton um that drives the learnings that we also gather from spiritism so self self knowledge and uh our um Evolution from an inner transformation perspective the other wrinkle is as you said Jada is the fact that uh this fear right fear is also related in in a way with our shadow right which is um that dark side of ourselves that uh hidden that uh that area that we repress consciously or not and instead we use a mask or create this Persona to protect the us from ourselves and and ourselves from others and try to be what we are not um again consciously or not that shadow we aspect of our personality may be there and when we say I am Brave so the word here is courage right that that goes against fear so if I am brave enough if I'm courageous enough I am going to to delve into this road this path toward self-discovery but then the question of self-esteem may come crashing into us which which is what right maybe that uh we mentioned before the fear failure um fear of I don't I don't know just out of inadequacy that I'm going to be rejected that I'm not going to be loved right so it's really important that we understand that this is a very real fear but with the work of self-discovery um there's also the the

that I'm going to be rejected that I'm not going to be loved right so it's really important that we understand that this is a very real fear but with the work of self-discovery um there's also the the the work of uh self-love and self forgiveness yes and one thing that in terms of self-esteem is um we know uh we have a tendency to look at the negative aspects of Life yeah and uh we do the same with us um though sometimes we don't want to realize that much oh yeah I I am a bit selfish bit you know why say that it's like if I put a bit before it's pay that much attention to it so uh but the thing is the encouragement here for us to get to know ourselves for self- knowledge is because it is the only way that we can guarantee that you know for the moment we if we are just a bit but probably we are not just a bit we are a lot of those things and we let's reach for the bit instead of being completely perfect that is going to take a little while but you see and this is when she says the self-esteem here is crucial for us to deal with that because if I keep on thinking that every negative trait that I'm going to find in my personality is going to put me down then it's not even worth visiting there I me we definitely not mature enough not prepared to deal with that it's um what what you you're talking about here it made me think I don't know uh justad if you agree with that but it made me think of uh individuals that uh and it's really the the hyper the their self their defense mechanism on on hyperdrive right uh so when you read um when you read and I read a while ago the biography of say Steve Jobs the the founder of Apple right um many of the people that were with him talked about this Distortion of reality and uh nobody could understand but that's what he needed there was his self this defense mechanism of his himself to be able to continue at what his path right I'm not going to say good or bad but it's just it was his path and we need to think about it uh when we look into this

is defense mechanism of his himself to be able to continue at what his path right I'm not going to say good or bad but it's just it was his path and we need to think about it uh when we look into this journey toward self-discovery self-awareness do we want to look at it from kind eyes right in in what you said I'm not just a bit uh arrogant I'm quite arrogant right but right now my defense mechanism allows me to see just a bit so that I can address that bit and then address a little bit more and yet a lot more when I'm ready don't you think yes absolutely absolutely but but uh again you know this uh Drive what deangel is is uh you know inspiring us to do you know regardless I mean it's not a point of just saying um well I'm a bit arrogant but everyone is is that right yes we are adults here so let's think about yeah I am but I know that and this is not how a person should be and I'm going to be addressing that according to my possibilities and I'm not going to stop loving me or thinking that I am an worth of anything because I recognize my you know my my fail yeah failures and and you know the the points the weak points and so it's about as you says to have a a positive self-image and I think I don't know if I understood well from your example from Steve Jobs but sometimes you know when people are just picking on the little little things and I'm thinking about the big picture I have to ignore what is here for for me to go and address uh and en reach where I want to reach and and and and when we we think about because uh one of the topics that we wanted to bring today as well is about the different types of of fear and um we we actually listed 10 of them and one of them that I I thought was very interesting let me see here uh if I can find it um I'm looking for it now is the the fear of failure yeah uh related to being a perfectionist yes and it plagues us it plagues us this perfectionism which is masks our fear failing exactly Yeah in our fear failure masks our fear of rejection of not being

eah uh related to being a perfectionist yes and it plagues us it plagues us this perfectionism which is masks our fear failing exactly Yeah in our fear failure masks our fear of rejection of not being accept right and it's just so interesting how it's all intertwined isn't it just yeah we say I'm a perfectionist okay nothing wrong with that but aren't you masking like you said perhaps the fear of failure and and and instead of thinking it is not good enough this work it's I am not good enough and so what happens in this feere of failure for instance we procrastinate what we have to do just to not uh just to avoid see the results because we we cannot deal with that it's almost like you you rejecting yourself because it's better to be rejected by yourself than by somebody else right exactly and and and sometimes you know we stay in this position like you know when we talk about fear of change or fear of the unknown H I always remember of this little story of this dog that is outside whining I brought a lot of times this story here whining and then a person goes by and ask the owner of the dog why is he whining there there's nothing we can do for him to stop what is you know causing so much trouble and they say oh he's the the honor say he's he's sitting on top of a neck and what so why he doesn't move if it's hurting him because it's not hurting enough enough yes and so I mean sometimes this fear of change this fear of the unknown is exactly that we are in an uncomfortable situation but we are afraid uh to move uh out of it and because it could be worse right it could be worse so I I yeah I I always think about it just actually when uh somebody is let's say comes to me and uh in my professional life I Mentor uh a number quite large number of uh young professionals right and they start and they just uh so with my many many years in working I have a mess some experience that I can help but uh whenever they come to me and they're just like angry and you know just annoyed uncomfortable and I said

st uh so with my many many years in working I have a mess some experience that I can help but uh whenever they come to me and they're just like angry and you know just annoyed uncomfortable and I said great now we're ready to make some change right right now the discomfort outweighs your your uh wine like the dog right you used to complain complain but did nothing about it but when it becomes that upsetting then you you you were triggered to do something about it an iy sorry but it just is just so stupid right I'm going to prolong my suffering yeah yeah right because I'm afraid of I mean I'm seeing that I'm driving in the direction of an abis yes to the last moment I'm not going to be changing the course right and this is those are things that uh I I think when we are talking about fear here is what we have to think about is this paralyzing me from the really new opportunities are you know and I even say just is it right is it paralyzing is it blocking me but to me the other part of this question is why yes right why as you mentioned why do you allow yourself to to drive toward that I don't know the Grand Canyon right this enormous Abyss th thelman Louise reference here right but you you you you're driving and you don't change your course so you're putting your blinders that are so heavy so big so uh blinding that you're neble to see the consequences of not changing and and I I just I I keep thinking that when we look for the why it's most often than not it is our ego our egoic construct that we are protecting not ourselves yeah I think that you know the way you put it there I say oh but I just I I just know this route yeah uh to this place yeah okay you know try a different one yeah if you know it's going to be leading you into disaster yeah you know what could be worse than that so I think it's it's very important that Jan DeAngelis mentioned this here and just for us to you know to to go before we wrap it up and talk about the neurosci sence as well I I think it's

than that so I think it's it's very important that Jan DeAngelis mentioned this here and just for us to you know to to go before we wrap it up and talk about the neurosci sence as well I I think it's very interesting the way that we can also put into that all the phobias that we have and because we also know and when we are talking about um the spiritual values and knowledge and spiritism about you know previous Incarnation reincarnation right which is a key aspect of our understanding of you know immortal existence and um knowing that sometimes those irrational fears come from the past or come from experiences in our childhood that we don't even remember you know so uh it's important for us also to have this uh with this knowledge and going through a process of self- knowledge you know we talking we talking to ourselves saying listen this is in the past and uh try to overcome it maybe we are not going to be overcoming it that much is interesting because I I I I have one of those phobias as acrophobia or I'm afraid of afraid of heights and I leave 35th floor so as you can see I have a little balcony here that I don't miss quite often but sometimes I just go there just to to use as a therapy you know that's awesome happen here anymore you know so be rational about it so this exposure that that she says but I I think H if we have to live here today thinking about a very important thing is is that love yourself yes H and understand that there are so many possibilities there are are brought to to you to us every day and um and and like she says have a positive way of looking at you you may recognize that there is a lot to be done but you have you know look at the last half full not half yeah yeah but but uh let's let's go ahead I'm gonna just take try to get you because you mentioned uh one to talk about the newer scientific uh pers perspective on on fear can we can we just talk a little bit about it what does Neuroscience tell us about this very basic emotion and and by that I mean every

o talk about the newer scientific uh pers perspective on on fear can we can we just talk a little bit about it what does Neuroscience tell us about this very basic emotion and and by that I mean every human being eight billion plus people have to face fear every day of their lives you see this is what it's so important as well and when we talk about this uh approach uh spiritual approach as uh in three different aspects like you you know the physical the emotional psychological and also the of course the physical one we all know how when we are anxious or even afraid that the heart beating the heart rate increases and we start sweating and and all of those things we feel that there is something happening with our bodies and uh of course you know the uh discharge of a necessary adrenaline is going to affect ourselves poison ourselves ourselves in a way and so they say that the amydala with is going to be sending signals to other parts of our brain like the hipotalamus and the Brain St it's going to be initiating a a a physiological response that is going to provoke this Rush of AD adrenaline uh and so you know when we are talking about this becoming aware going through a process of self- knowledge and uh having a you know working for a high self self-esteem and um and and all the changes that we uh we have to go through it's important to know that if we don't do that we are affecting our physical health and what is interesting is that even from a neuroscience aspect they recommend uh mindfulness practices uh if we are engaged in any kind of spiritual tradiction that can Traditions that can help us as well that is going to be reducing this activity that are going to to be uh working enhancing the function of our prefrontal cortex so it's it's it's important and I think it's it's F fascinating how itver to the same point here we are not talking about uh philosophies religions or or or just pure science we are saying listen we we you analyze through an aspect I analyze through another one but

ow itver to the same point here we are not talking about uh philosophies religions or or or just pure science we are saying listen we we you analyze through an aspect I analyze through another one but we are all going to the same place and basically the the the the the way for us to you know the antidote for all that it's basically the same is you know go to therapy to calm yourself down having this mindfulness practices or like we say you know the prayer the meditation the engaging your with positive actions that it makes you feel good every time you do charity you are actually doing charity to our to yourself so I I I think it's really so amazing uh when we think about that and uh and like Joanna d'angel says when we understand and confront fear uh we use that as a very powerful tool for our personal growth absolutely I I think this is this is beautiful uh what you said tying it all together so spiritual emotional right psychological and physical manifestations of fear and their root causes but all deals with the same type of uh response to to deal with that they're very much the same and what can we maybe count to to five I just I don't know so mindfulness breathing prayer meditation and do get away from yourself by working for others right so charitable work community service or just look call somebody pay attention to others who are going through something uh and I I call this this is my own way of saying get away from yourself just start looking uh Beyond you and those are those will make you few better so if you are suffering um fear that is paralyzing you from doing things think about it and seek help right don't uh don't imprison yourself to the fear look at yourself first and foremost with love with forgiveness and know that you are not alone just any final words before we say goodbye what I was thinking is you know do not be afraid but be cautious yes absolutely do not be afraid be cautious because being cautious is not bad right and uh as I said we we we both watched

say goodbye what I was thinking is you know do not be afraid but be cautious yes absolutely do not be afraid be cautious because being cautious is not bad right and uh as I said we we we both watched this very cute and interesting uh movie it is a uh as as as just start to mention it was made for children and and young adults but it is timeless and it's ageless it is really speaks to all of us in the realm of our emotional self our inside as it comes out to to to be seen by the audiences like you and me but just to thank you so very much for your time today and everyone so long what